PTTS teams breaking the law?

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Replies

  • Joey ButtonsJoey Buttons Posts: 11,849 AG
    Please do. Time to call out the PTTS boys who think they are above the law.
    FSU is the best football team of all time!
  • whitebaconwhitebacon Posts: 354 Officer
    I've waited probably five years to respond to this crap. Please don't doubt my resolve in this matter.
  • whitebaconwhitebacon Posts: 354 Officer
    The PTTS won't be back in BG. Take in to the bank.
  • Finicky 1Finicky 1 Posts: 30 Deckhand
    Whitebacon you don't want anyone to know who you are for obvious reason's you sound like a terrorist your so scary each thread you are starting crap with people making threats you must be god or should I say Jihad.Grow up and contibute something useful to this or go away.
  • AlwaysAbuAlwaysAbu Posts: 476 Deckhand
    The tag offers legal transfer of possession from the state to the angler making it legal to possess or harvest.

    As of the July 1, 2012 "Basic recreational saltwater fishing regulations for state waters of Florida" chart found here: http://myfwc.com/media/2075522/saltwater_regulations_chart.pdf it states in the Remarks column regarding tarpon " Requires $50 tarpon tag to possess or harvest."

    That could be interpreted as the difference between a live and dead fish. Live referring to possession and harvest referring to dead.

    Either way tags are non transferable nor multi useable regardless of a live release. One card with one tag should self explain that. The state deems that fish "off the books" which is why there is a set limit of 2500 Tarpon tags sold annually. The state has determined that is the maximum tarpon harvest for the entire state and if some are released that were tagged then that is just a best case scenario but no guarantee they will survive post release.

    With all due respect to Capt Dave, I'm sorry but the form must be returned within 5 days on the tag's use. Although a fish is realeased alive after weighing, it is not "...released immediately to the water at the place where the fish was caught."

    I would also like to ask the question "At the weigh scale is the fish length taken?" As this is a requirement as wel per 68B-32.003 as well for the form.

    Reference: https://www.flrules.org/Gateway/View_notice.asp?id=2618726

    68B-32.003 Tarpon Tags: Required for Possession; Report; Annual Issuance; Taxidermy; Limitation on Number of Tags Issued Annually; Limitation on Number of Tags Issued to Professional Fishing Guides.
    (1) No person shall take, kill, or possess any tarpon, unless such person has purchased a tarpon tag and securely attached it through the lower jaw of the fish. Within 5 days after the landing of a tagged tarpon, the person possessing it shall submit a form to the Commission (Form DMF-SL3200 (3-05), incorporated herein by reference) indicating the length, weight, and physical condition of the tarpon and the date and location where the fish was caught. Additional tags may be denied to any person or guide who fails to provide the required information.

    (2) Tarpon tags are valid for the period beginning July 1 each year and continuing through June 30 of the following year or until used, whichever occurs first. Before August 15 of each year, each tax collector shall submit to the Commission all unused tags for the previous license year along with a written audit report as to the number of unused tags, on forms provided by the Commission (Form DMF-SL3210 (3-05), incorporated herein by reference). Tarpon tags are nontransferable, except for those distributed by professional fishing guides pursuant to subsection (5).

    (3) Subsection (1) shall not apply to anyone who immediately returns a tarpon uninjured to the water at the place where the fish was caught. The prohibition of possession of an untagged tarpon in subsection (1) shall not apply to a taxidermist who removes the tag during the process of mounting a tarpon. The removed tag shall remain with the fish during any subsequent storage or shipment.

    (4) In any license year, the total number of tarpon tags issued shall not exceed 2,500.

    (5) Each professional fishing guide may purchase tarpon tags for subsequent transfer to individual customers; provided, however, that the total number of tags issued during any license year to professional fishing guides shall not exceed 1,250.
    Specific Authority Art. IV, Sec. 9, Fla. Const. Law Implemented Art. IV, Sec. 9, Fla. Const. History–New 11-30-88, Amended 11-1-89, 10-1-90, 12-4-91, 11-26-92, 11-29-93, 1-1-95, 1-1-96, 11-27-96, 11-12-97, 11-16-98, Formerly 46-32.003, Amended 3-1-05.

    Where I think there could also be an argument against ANY Tarpon tournament is 68B-32.006 Sale Prohibited, Transport Regulated


    (1) No person shall sell, offer for sale, barter, exchange for merchandise or services, transport for sale or exchange within or without the state, offer to purchase or purchase any tarpon.

    In the PTTS tarpon tournament, there is an exchange of merchandise for the heaviest tarpon weighed. Even in an all release tournament, it still could be argued that the only way to obtain the prizes is to exchange for caught tarpon. The tournament verification of catch is recognized acceptance of the tarpon, it doesn't specify physical exchange, merely "exchange". Try getting the prize without the exchange of tournament acceptance of your catch??? Maybe a stretch...(1-800- Ask- Gary for legal clarification)


    On a seperate note: On page 3 of the FWC regulations for 2012:http://myfwc.com/media/2075479/saltwater_regulations_adfree.pdf it clealry shows a tarpon being over half its body being lifted vertically out of the water so I think according to FWC that as long as the entire fish is not removed for pics, a tarpon can be partially lifted from the water. A picture says 1000 words.

    I do not have an axe to grind with Capt Dave or the PTTS or even jig fishing. Hopefully this would offer clarity to the actual regs.
  • Capt. Scott HughesCapt. Scott Hughes Posts: 317 Officer
    Where are all the jigging experts when they are called out to respond to our questions? Capt. Ozzie and Dave are the only ones and Ozzie doesn't even jig that much.
  • bentrods4ubentrods4u Posts: 52 Deckhand
    I asked about the tarpon, out off the water.. There is no law that says you cannot take a picture of a tarpon out of the water, there is no law that says you can... In all reality, they recomend you not taken large tarpon out of the water, but it is better to remove juveniles out of the water, while removing the hook... I post pics all the time with customers with juvenile tarpon out of the water. A quick picture is not possession! how ever it is up to a FWC officer to determine, at what point, and if you had intent to possess, or harvest. This is the response.

    Andrew Medina

    Another FWC rule defines the proper catch and release techniques for all reef fishes, including goliath groupers. It states that "Harvest means the catching or taking of a fish by any means whatsoever, followed by a reduction of such fish to possession. Fish that are caught but immediately returned to the water free, alive and unharmed are not harvested.
    Can you clearify this when it comes to tarpon, please? If you catch a fish, and remove juveniles out of the water, to remove the hook, take a picture in the process of removing the hook, and put it back in the water immediately, unharmed is this illegal? We are not taliking about endangered species.

    Like · · June 27 at 7:11am near Port Charlotte





    MyFWC
    From our Fisheries Division - hope this helps! : "A fish is reduced to possession when the fish is not “immediately returned to the water free, alive and unharmed.” This often comes back to the intent and actions of the angler and officer discretion. For example, in some cases, it may be quicker and better for the fish, especially if it is a smaller fish, to remove it from the water to get the hook out. For a larger fish, we recommend not removing the fish from the water. Removal from the water can cause internal damage to larger fish. If a photo is taken quickly as the fish is being released, then that may not mean possession. If the angler takes an extended amount of time to take a photo of the fish, and it is not returned to the water free, alive and unharmed, then that would not be immediate release, and, therefore, the fish would be reduced to possession. Law enforcement officers are encouraged to use their discretion and educate the public on this philosophy."

    I stand behind all my fish handleing practices.. and so do most anglers!
  • One Eyed WillyOne Eyed Willy Posts: 7 Greenhorn
    That was Perry Masonesque. Morgan and Morgan could use a guy like you. But in the end jealousy is a stinky cologne.
  • bentrods4ubentrods4u Posts: 52 Deckhand
    whitebacon wrote: »
    Dave Markett - why do you protest such a flawed, flammable, and unwinnable argument? I'm now getting involved. I’ve got pictures of you, Daylan, and customers fishing with >3 lines post law and you fishing from the Captain's chair. Don't make me post them.

    Can you please show me in the "Laws" where it says a captain can not fish? http://myfwc.com/news/news-releases/2012/april/20/boca-grande-pass/ as I understand it, as long as there is not more than three lines in the water...written laws, or rules only. not recomendations..
  • whitebaconwhitebacon Posts: 354 Officer
    68B-4.018 Boca Grande Pass Gear Restrictions.
    (1) BOCA GRANDE PASS – For purposes of the restrictions specified in subsections (2) and (3), Boca Grande Pass shall consist of all waters located within the following boundaries:
    Begin at the westernmost edge of the Phosphate Dock (26°43.216' North Latitude, 82°15.517' West Longitude) on the southeast bay side of Gasparilla Island; thence proceed due east on a straight line to the westernmost edge of the intracoastal waterway (26°43.216' North Latitude, 82°14.703' West Longitude); thence proceed in a southerly direction to the #75 Intracoastal Waterway Marker (26°42.299' North Latitude, 82°14.580' West Longitude) on the northeast bay side of Cayo Costa; thence proceed around the northern tip of Cayo Costa along the shore to the QR test buoy (26°42.002' North Latitude, 82°15.448' West Longitude) on the northwest Gulf coast side of Cayo Costa; thence proceed westerly on a straight line to the #12 red buoy (26°42.336' North Latitude, 82°16.748' West Longitude) marking the entrance to Boca Grande Pass; thence proceed northeast on a straight line to the easternmost edge of the concrete pier ruins (26°43.165' North Latitude, 82°15.778' West Longitude) at the lighthouse beach on the southwest Gulf side of Gasparilla Island; thence proceed along the shore around the southern tip of Gasparilla Island to the Phosphate Dock, the point of beginning.
    (2) In Boca Grande Pass, during the months of April, May, and June each year:
    (a) A maximum of three fishing lines may be deployed from a vessel at any one time.
    (b) No person shall use, fish with, or place in the water any breakaway gear.
    Specific Authority Art. IV, Sec. 9, Fla. Const. Law Implemented Art. IV, Sec. 9, Fla. Const. History–New 7-1-04.

    Bent,

    I don't believe I alleged that fishing from the "captain's chair" was illegal. I do know that > 3 lines is not permitted, and after the law was enacted, I took many pictures of the violators.

    I don't think any competent individual would acknowledge that fishing from the captain's chair in BGP is a safe practice, or advised to the novice angler and boat owner.

    If the Captain is so desperate to get a "bite", perhaps he should put his people on fish where a legitimate "bite" is likely, or even possible.

    The "reasons" for captains fishing from the helm in BGP is obvious. Who else is more adept, qualified, and experienced at snagging a fish??????
  • bentrods4ubentrods4u Posts: 52 Deckhand
    I am sorry thats what it sounded like,,
    q: I don't think any competent individual would acknowledge that fishing from the captain's chair in BGP is a safe practice, or advised to the novice angler and boat owner.
    That is your oppinion and you are entitled to it, but far as legal, oppinion and "laws" are two different things!!!
  • Finicky 1Finicky 1 Posts: 30 Deckhand
    whitebacon wrote: »
    68B-4.018 Boca Grande Pass Gear Restrictions.
    (1) BOCA GRANDE PASS – For purposes of the restrictions specified in subsections (2) and (3), Boca Grande Pass shall consist of all waters located within the following boundaries:
    Begin at the westernmost edge of the Phosphate Dock (26°43.216' North Latitude, 82°15.517' West Longitude) on the southeast bay side of Gasparilla Island; thence proceed due east on a straight line to the westernmost edge of the intracoastal waterway (26°43.216' North Latitude, 82°14.703' West Longitude); thence proceed in a southerly direction to the #75 Intracoastal Waterway Marker (26°42.299' North Latitude, 82°14.580' West Longitude) on the northeast bay side of Cayo Costa; thence proceed around the northern tip of Cayo Costa along the shore to the QR test buoy (26°42.002' North Latitude, 82°15.448' West Longitude) on the northwest Gulf coast side of Cayo Costa; thence proceed westerly on a straight line to the #12 red buoy (26°42.336' North Latitude, 82°16.748' West Longitude) marking the entrance to Boca Grande Pass; thence proceed northeast on a straight line to the easternmost edge of the concrete pier ruins (26°43.165' North Latitude, 82°15.778' West Longitude) at the lighthouse beach on the southwest Gulf side of Gasparilla Island; thence proceed along the shore around the southern tip of Gasparilla Island to the Phosphate Dock, the point of beginning.
    (2) In Boca Grande Pass, during the months of April, May, and June each year:
    (a) A maximum of three fishing lines may be deployed from a vessel at any one time.
    (b) No person shall use, fish with, or place in the water any breakaway gear.
    Specific Authority Art. IV, Sec. 9, Fla. Const. Law Implemented Art. IV, Sec. 9, Fla. Const. History–New 7-1-04.

    Bent,

    I don't believe I alleged that fishing from the "captain's chair" was illegal. I do know that > 3 lines is not permitted, and after the law was enacted, I took many pictures of the violators.

    I don't think any competent individual would acknowledge that fishing from the captain's chair in BGP is a safe practice, or advised to the novice angler and boat owner.

    If the Captain is so desperate to get a "bite", perhaps he should put his people on fish where a legitimate "bite" is likely, or even possible.

    The "reasons" for captains fishing from the helm in BGP is obvious. Who else is more adept, qualified, and experienced at snagging a fish??????

    SO 3 lines are not permitted according to what you wrote.
  • Finicky 1Finicky 1 Posts: 30 Deckhand
    So you got lots of pictures of everyone fishing with 3 lines because according to you we can't fish 3 lines.
  • beargonefishinbeargonefishin Posts: 64 Deckhand
    Finicky 1 wrote: »
    So you got lots of pictures of everyone fishing with 3 lines because according to you we can't fish 3 lines.

    >3 means greater than 3..or more than 3.
  • bentrods4ubentrods4u Posts: 52 Deckhand
    whitebacon wrote: »
    68B-4.018 Boca Grande Pass Gear Restrictions.
    (1) BOCA GRANDE PASS – For purposes of the restrictions specified in subsections (2) and (3), Boca Grande Pass shall consist of all waters located within the following boundaries:
    Begin at the westernmost edge of the Phosphate Dock (26°43.216' North Latitude, 82°15.517' West Longitude) on the southeast bay side of Gasparilla Island; thence proceed due east on a straight line to the westernmost edge of the intracoastal waterway (26°43.216' North Latitude, 82°14.703' West Longitude); thence proceed in a southerly direction to the #75 Intracoastal Waterway Marker (26°42.299' North Latitude, 82°14.580' West Longitude) on the northeast bay side of Cayo Costa; thence proceed around the northern tip of Cayo Costa along the shore to the QR test buoy (26°42.002' North Latitude, 82°15.448' West Longitude) on the northwest Gulf coast side of Cayo Costa; thence proceed westerly on a straight line to the #12 red buoy (26°42.336' North Latitude, 82°16.748' West Longitude) marking the entrance to Boca Grande Pass; thence proceed northeast on a straight line to the easternmost edge of the concrete pier ruins (26°43.165' North Latitude, 82°15.778' West Longitude) at the lighthouse beach on the southwest Gulf side of Gasparilla Island; thence proceed along the shore around the southern tip of Gasparilla Island to the Phosphate Dock, the point of beginning.
    (2) In Boca Grande Pass, during the months of April, May, and June each year:
    (a) A maximum of three fishing lines may be deployed from a vessel at any one time.
    (b) No person shall use, fish with, or place in the water any breakaway gear.
    Specific Authority Art. IV, Sec. 9, Fla. Const. Law Implemented Art. IV, Sec. 9, Fla. Const. History–New 7-1-04.

    Bent,

    I don't believe I alleged that fishing from the "captain's chair" was illegal. I do know that > 3 lines is not permitted, and after the law was enacted, I took many pictures of the violators.

    I don't think any competent individual would acknowledge that fishing from the captain's chair in BGP is a safe practice, or advised to the novice angler and boat owner.

    If the Captain is so desperate to get a "bite", perhaps he should put his people on fish where a legitimate "bite" is likely, or even possible.

    The "reasons" for captains fishing from the helm in BGP is obvious. Who else is more adept, qualified, and experienced at snagging a fish??????

    "3 lines is not permitted, and after the law was enacted, I took many pictures of the violators."
    Are you sure you know what, you are talking about? There can not be more then 3 lines, from the vessel!
  • ScottKScottK Posts: 214 Officer
    bentrods4u wrote: »
    "3 lines is not permitted, and after the law was enacted, I took many pictures of the violators."
    Are you sure you know what, you are talking about? There can not be more then 3 lines, from the vessel!

    There's a "greater than (>) " sign preceding his "3".
  • CaptainBlyCaptainBly Posts: 2,156 Captain
    Scott, I think you need to further that explanation. GREATER than 3 (>3) as in 4, 5, 6, etc... is against the law. But 0, 1, 2 or 3 is totally fine and legal.

    Now, if it was ≥ 3 (greater than or equal to 3) then 3 would be bad.. very bad.

    Of course, the 3 line rule did nothing but increase the # of boats to the pass by oh, 30-50%. Dumbest rule that came out of this whole debate.
    In Loving Memory of James Zielske, January 19, 1957-July 5, 2013
  • Capt Dave MarkettCapt Dave Markett Posts: 26 Greenhorn
    CaptainBly is a wise, wise man.
  • doubledupdoubledup Posts: 235 Officer
    Not really.

    Is it ok if I send this thread to one of the sposnors involved who you are not trying to intimidate and thinks he is?

    Ooops, too late.

    What's the word Gary? Did you email this thread yet like you said?
  • Joey ButtonsJoey Buttons Posts: 11,849 AG
    doubledup wrote: »
    What's the word Gary? Did you email this thread yet like you said?


    :popcorn:
    FSU is the best football team of all time!
  • Joey ButtonsJoey Buttons Posts: 11,849 AG
    Funny how Gary has left this thread after getting called out. Typical dodge and duck from someone who doesn't know what the hell he his talking about.
    FSU is the best football team of all time!
  • MACDMACD Lee CountyPosts: 4,868 Captain
    Funny how Gary has left this thread after getting called out. Typical dodge and duck from someone who doesn't know what the hell he his talking about.

    Are you still pissed because you got spanked at the 1st FS forum bash..................get over it, because it has nothing to do with the current topics at hand.
  • Joey ButtonsJoey Buttons Posts: 11,849 AG
    Not really.

    Is it ok if I send this thread to one of the sposnors involved who you are not trying to intimidate and thinks he is?

    Ooops, too late.
    MACD wrote: »
    Are you still pissed because you got spanked at the 1st FS forum bash..................get over it, because it has nothing to do with the current topics at hand.


    LOL....you are a funny, bitter old man. How does Chucks response have nothing to do with this thread ?

    How is the lawsuit against your son going by the way MACD ? Have you drained him dry yet ?
    FSU is the best football team of all time!
  • whitebaconwhitebacon Posts: 354 Officer
    If I confused Finicky with my days earlier post, I should clarify that it is my pedestrian view and understanding that fishing with GREATER than 3 lines is a VIOLATION of Florida State Statutes ("law" - for finfin).

    I do know that my wife is an extremely well-regarded and qualified clinical psychologist, professor, and author who specializes in the treatment of autism. Many days she tests children for symptoms or diagnosis of autism. I'm offering a free diagnosis for "finfinfin".

    If Finny passes that test - "for minimal intelligent quotient" - I'm offering basic math and english tutoring for him at my expense.

    Thank you to those of you who posted - that could actually understand what I wrote, and tried to explain to poor Huck Fin
  • Finicky 1Finicky 1 Posts: 30 Deckhand
    Oh my mistake on the <>sign.Your such a funny guy.I love your comments though it makes me laugh.I won't resort to name calling but I can't wait to meet you in person.


    You sound like an old hasbeen Capt that used to be on here his name was Joe Verdino....
  • Gary S. ColecchioGary S. Colecchio Posts: 24,922 AG
    Or the former editor of a local scandal sheet.
    "If I can't win, I won't play." - Doris Colecchio.

    "Well Gary, the easiest way to look tall is to stand in a room full of short people." - Curtis Bostick

    "All these forums, with barely any activity, are like a neglected old cemetery that no one visits anymore."- anonymouse
  • MACDMACD Lee CountyPosts: 4,868 Captain
    How is the lawsuit against your son going by the way MACD ? Have you drained him dry yet ?

    I really don't know what your talking about. Joey Buttons > nutjob = forum fool.
  • Joey ButtonsJoey Buttons Posts: 11,849 AG
    MACD wrote: »
    I really don't know what your talking about. Joey Buttons > nutjob = forum fool.


    Riiiiiggght Badger.

    Keep draining your son dry. In more ways than one.
    FSU is the best football team of all time!
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