deep cycle batteries

Ok so basically right now my boat has three optima blue tops, 2 starting and 1 trolling. one of the starting batts seems to have crapped out and since the troller is a dual purpose (that one came with the boat) I figured I would switch it to cranking duties and get a designated TRUE deep cycle for trolling. space is not an issue, I want the power to be there all the time (minimum group 27, more likely 29 or even 31). What are yall using with good success??

Replies

  • Liquid TheropyLiquid Theropy Posts: 608 Officer
    Hate to say it but, I have a walmart neverstart for my trolling motor. A napa dual purpose for the house battery. Both are doing well. Just cannot justify the price or the blue or red top batteries. Both are around a year to a year and a half old. They work for me but that's just my thoughts....
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]AKA Flatheadcat
  • redeye76redeye76 Posts: 448 Deckhand
    Hawk, I have two blue top Optima hooked in series for my 24V troller. They are now six years old and no problems. Use them a lot.
  • Fishin RodFishin Rod Posts: 2,620 Captain
    redeye76 wrote: »
    Hawk, I have two blue top Optima hooked in series for my 24V troller. They are now six years old and no problems. Use them a lot.

    That's some good information, I was wondering how long they would last. They are a little pricey as compared to "Wally World" batteries and I have been getting about three years out of the "WW" batts.
    "Be what you is"....... Isaiah Minter
  • lakemanlakeman Posts: 755 Officer
    Not boat related, but I cannot keep the optima batteries in my wife's Corvette, the problem may be that it is so seldom driven that the charge is always lower than it should be. I now have a trickle charger on it and have not had a problem for yhe last two years. One thing about optima batteries, is the warranty, no questions ask if you go back to where you bought it. However, for their price of about $200+- there should not be be a warranty issue.
  • troutman57troutman57 Posts: 3,691 Captain
    Dave I use (i use them a whole lot) 2 Trojan sc225. They are about 200 each and are what most of the bassmasters use unless they are sponsored. I did a ton of research before buying them and so far I am very happy with them. Over the past year I have cycled them 250 -300 times. Spano golf carts in Ocala carries them. He ordered mine for me in a couple days. I burned through a set of Walmat batteries in 8 months.
    This place Rocks if yer a crabber
  • red010480red010480 Posts: 304 Deckhand
    Interstate makes some good ones too.
  • angler18angler18 Posts: 2,037 Captain
    Hawk232 wrote: »
    Ok so basically right now my boat has three optima blue tops, 2 starting and 1 trolling. one of the starting batts seems to have crapped out and since the troller is a dual purpose (that one came with the boat) I figured I would switch it to cranking duties and get a designated TRUE deep cycle for trolling. space is not an issue, I want the power to be there all the time (minimum group 27, more likely 29 or even 31). What are yall using with good success??

    Optima batteries do not take a fast charge very well. If you haven't tried yet, charge it at the lowest setting (trickle is best) for a few days. They normally will wake up and be just fine!
  • Hawk232Hawk232 Posts: 327 Officer
    dont get my wrong, i LOVE my optimas! 3 blue tops in the boat, a red top in the truck and a red top in the boat i just sold two days ago. I have NEVER had one fail. I had a redtop that i bought used last me through a firehawk, then the camaro, sat for a while then into a mustang and finally i sold that car with it in there, that was a period of about 6 years and it was USED to begin with!!!

    that being said, there is no denying that a dual purpose battery will not last (per charge) as long as a deep cycle will. I have heard alot about trojan and deka and was looking to see if there are others i should consider.

    Kyle, what technology are those trojans? agm, gel??
  • Hawk232Hawk232 Posts: 327 Officer
    angler18 wrote: »
    Optima batteries do not take a fast charge very well. If you haven't tried yet, charge it at the lowest setting (trickle is best) for a few days. They normally will wake up and be just fine!

    unfortunatly this one sat on a 2 amp charge for a solid day (until the charger went into float mode) and yesterday it still did not have the juice to crank my boat
  • troutman57troutman57 Posts: 3,691 Captain
    Hawk232 wrote: »
    Kyle, what technology are those trojans? agm, gel??

    Good old school lead acid. BTW look for these ratings amp hours and rated cycles the higher the number the better.
    I believe the trojans are group 31 batteries.
    For what it's worth Kevin Van Dam uses sc225s
    What Joe says about charging is very true. SLOW trickle charge is always best and often folks will replace a perfectly good battery when the on board charger is not fully charging the batteries.
    This place Rocks if yer a crabber
  • Doc StressorDoc Stressor Homosassa, FLPosts: 2,515 Captain
    I've had good luck with Optima Blue Tops as well. I changed out a set out on one of my previous boats after 6 years just because they were old. The pair that replaced them is still in the boat after 7 years. These were just used as starting batteries and run the electronics including downriggers. They aren't good trolling motor batteries because of their low amp hour capacity. That's the only thing that determines how long you can run your trolling motor between charges.

    The Trojan SCS225 is a group 31 with 225 min of capacity at 25 amp. The group 31 Blue Top only has 155 min of reserve capacity. The Trojans are the best bang for the buck.

    I've never had a boat with a trolling motor until recently, so I don't have any marine experience with the Trojan. But I've used them in RVs for many years and found that the SCS225 had a greater capacity and lasted a lot longer than other deep cycles that I've tried. You need to keep them topped up with water and stored fully charged in order to get the best service.
  • troutman57troutman57 Posts: 3,691 Captain
    You might want to look at Delco Voyager batteries as they are made by the same company as the trojans. They also have good ratings and good reviews but are a bit less expensive. Keep in mind that amp hour rating is the important thing with trolling motor batteries. Cold Cranking amps is not important since you will not be using the batteries to start engines.
    This place Rocks if yer a crabber
  • Hawk232Hawk232 Posts: 327 Officer
    I have tried delco in the past and was rather disappointed... Will look into Trojan. I have also read that a slow charge is bad for deep cycle batteries that they need a 10 or 12 amp charge to burn off impurities. That will require some more research on my part.

    Do deep cycle batteries even have cranking amp ratings since that's not their intended use?
  • Doc StressorDoc Stressor Homosassa, FLPosts: 2,515 Captain
    The generally do list cranking amps for deep cycles. You can use them for starting batteries in a pinch. But their ratings are lower than similarly sized starting or dual purpose batteries.

    Here is a link with a lot of good info on deep cycle batteries and batteries in general:

    http://www.windsun.com/Batteries/Battery_FAQ.htm
  • csanderscsanders Posts: 471 Deckhand
    troutman57 wrote: »
    Dave I use (i use them a whole lot) 2 Trojan sc225. They are about 200 each and are what most of the bassmasters use unless they are sponsored. I did a ton of research before buying them and so far I am very happy with them. Over the past year I have cycled them 250 -300 times. Spano golf carts in Ocala carries them. He ordered mine for me in a couple days. I burned through a set of Walmat batteries in 8 months.

    $200 is a lot to pay for a trojan but I guess if you're going to reuse them 200 times it's worth the money in the end. Does she seem to mind?

    I am however, rather impressed that you have to use two of them at a time. Way to go!

    (sorry, a little cold weather time humor there... lol)
  • Travis GTravis G Kentucky😢Posts: 500 Deckhand
    i have an optima for cranking. it came with the boat. the best batt i have ever had for deep cycle was a DEKA. dont hear much about them but.....interstate has done well for me also
  • Hawk232Hawk232 Posts: 327 Officer
    so it seems to be between trojan and deka... since i dont know anyone with a deka to base my opinion off of looks like i will be going with a trojan (if this one does turn out to be bad)
  • screamin seamanscreamin seaman Posts: 1,492 Officer
    angler18 wrote: »
    Optima batteries do not take a fast charge very well. If you haven't tried yet, charge it at the lowest setting (trickle is best) for a few days. They normally will wake up and be just fine!

    I searched A LOT before going with my optimas and everything I read said to charge as quick as possible, but not too much to cause it to over heat. Do you have anything to back the trickle charge theory?

    I know they say that from a deep discharge most chargers won't see the optima as being low, instead it will see it as fully charged and switch off. To charge a very deeply discharged optima at home, the best way is to hook it to another lead/acid battery (+ to+ and - to -) and then hook the charger to it.


    Ohh and I have two optimas and an Odyssey. Love them all!
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  • Hawk232Hawk232 Posts: 327 Officer
    I know they say that from a deep discharge most chargers won't see the optima as being low, instead it will see it as fully charged and switch off. To charge a very deeply discharged optima at home, the best way is to hook it to another lead/acid battery (+ to+ and - to -) and then hook the charger to it.

    now that is interesting! i may have to try that before i lose hope on the "dead" optima
  • csanderscsanders Posts: 471 Deckhand
    I've had to jump start a few very dead nim-h batteries before to get a charger to see them by using the same method. I hook to a good battery for a few minutes then take it off and the charger will see them.
  • angler18angler18 Posts: 2,037 Captain
    I searched A LOT before going with my optimas and everything I read said to charge as quick as possible, but not too much to cause it to over heat. Do you have anything to back the trickle charge theory?

    I know they say that from a deep discharge most chargers won't see the optima as being low, instead it will see it as fully charged and switch off. To charge a very deeply discharged optima at home, the best way is to hook it to another lead/acid battery (+ to+ and - to -) and then hook the charger to it.


    Ohh and I have two optimas and an Odyssey. Love them all!

    Two weeks ago I had one do like you said, charger said full charge and would shut down. Checked the battery and i think it was 6.3 volts. Put it on a trickle for 2 days and was just under 11 volts. Left it on for 2 more days and has been good as new.
  • brokenskegbrokenskeg Posts: 39 Greenhorn
    Ive always used the Optima blue tops in my boats and have never had a problem out of them . I always used a trickle charger as well . ALSO , the best price I found them were at Sams Club of all places .
  • screamin seamanscreamin seaman Posts: 1,492 Officer
    angler18 wrote: »
    Two weeks ago I had one do like you said, charger said full charge and would shut down. Checked the battery and i think it was 6.3 volts. Put it on a trickle for 2 days and was just under 11 volts. Left it on for 2 more days and has been good as new.

    My underedjumicated theory on that is that most trickle chargers are "dumb." In the sense that they take 120vac from the wall and turn it to 13vdc at about 1A output, and thats all they do. With a charge rate of 1A it is almost impossible to over charge ANY battery! And with that it doesn't need to be a "smart" charger and check the current condition of the battery when it is hooked up... soooo it may be able to able to bring an optima "back to life."

    "Smart" chargers work by checking the internal resistance of the battery when it is first hooked up. Optimas and other AGM batteries show the same same resistance when fully charged and fully discharged. Thats why "smart" chargers often don't work for deeply discharged Optimas.
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  • Doc StressorDoc Stressor Homosassa, FLPosts: 2,515 Captain
    Your underedjumicated theories are exactly right.

    You don't need a regulator with a charger that only puts out an amp or so. Once the battery is fully charged, the extra energy is lost as heat. But since the current flow is so low, the battery never gets hot enough to boil off the electrolyte.

    You explanation of why smart chargers can't "see" a fully discharged battery is also correct. The same holds true for fully discharged flooded cell batteries. The internal resistance is higher than the setting for a fully charged battery, so depending on the charger, you either get a fault or a fully charged reading. A fully discharged battery can often be brought back to life by connecting it to another battery or to a dumb charger for a while. Once some of the sulfate is removed from the surface of the plates, the resistance will drop and the battery will be able to take a charge.

    You don't have to charge AGM batteries slowly. With a smart charger, they will reach the fully charged state faster than a flooded cell. As long as the plates aren't sulfated the internal resistance is very low and they will take as many amps as an alternator or charger can produce. But they can be ruined by over charging. So a smart charger will start to decrease the current once the 80% charge state is reached.

    AGM batteries can damage some outboard alternators is you regularly let them get close to fully discharged. Some alternators aren't rated to run continuously at their maximum amperage output. As long as you don't let your AGM batteries get run down, they are fine for marine engine starting.
  • screamin seamanscreamin seaman Posts: 1,492 Officer
    Thanks for the back up Doc!
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