Home Fly Fishing

Do they catch fish?

Wra22Wra22 Posts: 228 Deckhand
i have been looking at some YouTube videos where guys make amazing shrimp with fly tying materials and UV resin. I am not a fly fisherman. A few questions:

1. Do these things catch fish?

2. Do they have to be worked a particular way?

3. Is a DOA shrimp just as good?

4. Are guys using them just for the satisfaction of using something they created?

5. Are they just for show.

Replies

  • greenie-slayergreenie-slayer Posts: 850 Officer
    1. yes
    2. Shrimp patterns can be worked many ways for different situations
    3. DOA is my go to if no fly fishing
    4.I like that feeling but it has to catch fish
    5. All the flies I tie are intended to stick in a fishes mouth.
  • sunflowersunflower osprey, floridaPosts: 655 Officer
    I love to do this because it gets people crazy-mad at me.
    They aren't making flies.
    They aren't fly-fishing.
    They are making acrylic lures, and using a fly rod to cast them.
    That's not fly-fishing.
    Doesn't mean it isn't ok, it just isn't fly-fishing.

    It is perfectly OK to do this if you enjoy it.

    Casting a live, dead, or acrylic shrimp with a fly-rod isn't fly-fishing.

    Here is the IGFA definition of a fly:




    Mark

    grace finds goodness in everything ...



  • limitlesslimitless Posts: 707 Officer
    So does that definition prohibit bead chain, lead eyes, artificial craft fur, glue on fake eyes, etc.?

    The Snook & Gamefish Foundation is now the Angler Action Program: http://angleractionfoundation.com/  Dedicated to Conservation and Education.  Please check us out.

    Angler Action Program: IAngler app trip log on your phone

  • greenie-slayergreenie-slayer Posts: 850 Officer
    Always a big argument among fly fishes about what is a fly and what is a lure. I know the trout guys get super crazy about it with egg pattern flies. I've had guys on the beach tell me any fly tied with any non natural material is not a fly. I usually respond with I hope you spin your own thread and forge your own hooks. Like Sunflower said do what you enjoy. Unless you dip your flies in gulp thats just wrong.
  • MRichardsonMRichardson Posts: 10,461 AG
    limitless said:
    So does that definition prohibit bead chain, lead eyes, artificial craft fur, glue on fake eyes, etc.?
    I wouldn't conclude that.  It says streamer, wet fly (which most lead eyes are on).  As for the other stuff, it does not exclude artificial materials.  Only artificial scents.  
    I have never seen live bones, but I know that they are often used by rich people to decorate the interior.
  • sunflowersunflower osprey, floridaPosts: 655 Officer
    edited May 2019 #7
    Dipping flies in Gulp! is funny ...
    because I definitely prefer to cast a slimey, fishey fly that just caught a fish.
    Is that now a "scented" fly?



    Mark

    grace finds goodness in everything ...



  • MRichardsonMRichardson Posts: 10,461 AG
    Nope, totally legit!
    Brings to mind a funny idea, like intentionally catching a ladyfish to "prime" your fly...

    I have never seen live bones, but I know that they are often used by rich people to decorate the interior.
  • fish_stixfish_stix Posts: 1,395 Officer
    I gotta ask: does the Gulp dip work? :D
  • greenie-slayergreenie-slayer Posts: 850 Officer
    I am sure it does. Its a weak move though. I am sure we have all thought about it though on those days when the fish have lock jaw. 
  • lemaymiamilemaymiami Posts: 4,448 Captain
    Where we fish (the backcountry of the Everglades, brackish or saltwaters...) ladyfish are everywhere... In fact we save the right sized ones and use them for bait when we're not fly fishing... The ladies - like snook and others are very hard on flies and leaders so I end up trimming back a leader tippet (whether it's the bite tippet or not...) very quickly after just a fish or two to get back to clean leader - and changing flies pretty regularly as well...

    For anyone who doesn't use a fly rod (and that's maybe 85% of all anglers...) give it a try... It will be like learning to fish all over again.  Those of us that do use the long rod know just what a challenge it is.  The only way you hurt the fish population with a fly rod.... is when they're laughing at you so hard they do themselves an injury...
    Tight Lines
    Bob LeMay
    (954) 435-5666
  • troutbomtroutbom Posts: 371 Deckhand
    Sunflower, out of respectful curiousity, where do you draw the line between fly and lure? I realize that there are differences of opinion in this regard, for example, in Pa there are Heritage Streams that severely restrict type of fly used. As you said, we should all do what we enjoy, but I notice your bonefish flies tied by greenie-slayer all appeared to have bead chain eyes and silicone  legs. Mine too by the way just not as pretty. But, I wonder, is there is a big difference between silicone legs on a shrimp fly and an acrylic coating on a shrimp fly?  I get what you are saying, they certainly seem more like a lure, but, at the end of the day we're casting the line and not the weight of the fly(lure). Doesnt it take the same fly fishing skill to place the acrylic fly on the plate at 60 feet as a silicone legged gotcha? (I'd say 80 feet but anyone who fishes with me would hurt themselves laughing) . However, as you said, we are all free to draw the line any where that makes us happy. My curiousity is genuine not argumentative. In candor, I'll throw anything that's not alive or heavy enough to throw on a plug rod. That includes squirmy wormies and beads if that's what it takes. One last anecdote. I was proudly showing Norm Zigler a picture of a 40" snook I caught on a clouser and he said sotto voice "jig". I refrained from commenting on his schminnow.
  • sunflowersunflower osprey, floridaPosts: 655 Officer
    troutbom,

            I guess it's sort of like the famous **** quote: "I know it when I see it." 

            For me, I would say a fly is a "fly." And by that, I mean something made out of fluffy, stringy material. I don't like anything that is plastic, or plasticky- like an acrylic fly. I once caught some Spanish on a little gummy "fly" my friend had. As far as I was concerned, it wasn't fly-fishing. Another friend of mine catches snook by throwing greenbacks with a fly rod.

              Uh, OK.

               For me, the main beauty of fly-fishing is placing art over success. I'd rather catch a beautiful fish, while wearing beautiful clothes, in a beautiful place, in a beautiful way. I like to fly-fish with "conventional" flies (but I'd use a hand-grenade and poison if it would get me a permit!!!!)

                I have no problem with bead-chains and lead-eyes. I am borderline with built-in rattles, don't believe in scenting flies.

                Not a fly:





                 Sort of a fly:


    Mark

    grace finds goodness in everything ...



  • troutbomtroutbom Posts: 371 Deckhand
    Fair enough! For those unfamiliar with the quote, it was S Ct Justice Potter Stewart who said of pornography that while he couldnt really define it, "I know it when I see it ...and this isnt it." Conviction reversed. BTW, that shrimp may not be a fly but it is pretty cool.  
  • Wra22Wra22 Posts: 228 Deckhand
    I know “regular” flies catch fish. I would like to see some pictures with these amazing looking crabs and shrimp in a fish’s mouth.

    Please understand I mean no disrespect. I think they show incredible talent on the part of the guys who make them. I just want to see if they really work. Thank you in advance fir any pictures posted. 
  • troutbomtroutbom Posts: 371 Deckhand
    DOA shrimp are extremely realistic and catch tons. I suspect the photo-realistic flies will too under right conditions . I tied some super realistic shrimp flies but Andros bonefish were underwhelmed while on same trip I caught 19 bonefish in a day and a half on one bedraggled plain old Gotcha. A hook down version of the realistic flies did well under dock lights when snook switched from tiny bait fish to shrimp . It's fun to try new stuff so have at it.
  • greenie-slayergreenie-slayer Posts: 850 Officer
    Just curious do Surf Candies count as flies? If not then I have been selling a lot of lures lately. I could probably make this without using any thread or tying at all. I know some of the very realistic crab flies work very well. I see a lot of guys using them on big trigger fish, and permit in the pacific. They do go pretty crazy with some but show results. Amazing the details and lengths they go to so the crab preform amazingly.There are realistic patterns that are only for show like the straw shrimp above. At the end of the day most fish aren't as smart as we think. GT will eat a sandal if thrown in front of them.
  • sunflowersunflower osprey, floridaPosts: 655 Officer
    If you're really asking how it looks to me ...Too much rubber.
    It would be OK as a head, but not a body.
    Not a fly.


    Mark

    grace finds goodness in everything ...



  • troutbomtroutbom Posts: 371 Deckhand
    Call it what ever but when the snook key in on rusty colored bay anchovies I'd tie that bad boy right on. 
  • retiredviejoretiredviejo San PedroPosts: 274 Deckhand
    Just curious do Surf Candies count as flies? If not then I have been selling a lot of lures lately. I could probably make this without using any thread or tying at all. I know some of the very realistic crab flies work very well. I see a lot of guys using them on big trigger fish, and permit in the pacific. They do go pretty crazy with some but show results. Amazing the details and lengths they go to so the crab preform amazingly.There are realistic patterns that are only for show like the straw shrimp above. At the end of the day most fish aren't as smart as we think. GT will eat a sandal if thrown in front of them.
    Permit it the pacific? Ocean? 
  • greenie-slayergreenie-slayer Posts: 850 Officer
    sunflower said:
    If you're really asking how it looks to me ...Too much rubber.
    It would be OK as a head, but not a body.
    Not a fly.



    Lure it is then. 

    Just curious do Surf Candies count as flies? If not then I have been selling a lot of lures lately. I could probably make this without using any thread or tying at all. I know some of the very realistic crab flies work very well. I see a lot of guys using them on big trigger fish, and permit in the pacific. They do go pretty crazy with some but show results. Amazing the details and lengths they go to so the crab preform amazingly.There are realistic patterns that are only for show like the straw shrimp above. At the end of the day most fish aren't as smart as we think. GT will eat a sandal if thrown in front of them.
    Permit it the pacific? Ocean? 
    Indo pacific so I guess Indian ocean. I do know never been to that side of the world so i'm not sure where 1 oceans ends and another begins
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