Home Off Topic

Disconnected by Disaster—Photos From a Battered Puerto Rico

2456716

Replies

  • Angler719Angler719 CrawfordvillePosts: 531 Officer
    Tarponator wrote: »
    Did you really say that?

    Do you know they voted earlier this summer to become a state....and like 97% said yes. Does that sound like a group that doesn't want to be American?

    This place never ceases to amaze me.

    Sure they vote for statehood now that they need a 120 billion dollar bailout, now we have to completely rebuild the island.
  • dragon baitdragon bait Posts: 8,454 Admiral
    "Where is the marines? Where is the air force?" Rodriguez asked. "We're Puerto Ricans. We're born American citizens. And we need help."

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/puerto-ricans-trump-amazing-maria-hurricane-1.4308643
  • NACl H2O LuvrNACl H2O Luvr Posts: 12,385 AG
    "Where is the marines? Where is the air force?" Rodriguez asked. "We're Puerto Ricans. We're born American citizens. And we need help."

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/puerto-ricans-trump-amazing-maria-hurricane-1.4308643

    US military sends ships, aircraft to Puerto Rico

    Updated 7:16 PM ET, Tue September 26, 2017

    150618125334-usns-comfort-15-exlarge-169.jpg

    The Navy hospital ship is just one part of the military's humanitarian assistance effort -- deploying assets to both Puerto Rico and the US Virgin Islands after the storm decimated critical infrastructure in the region.
    The USS Kearsarge Amphibious Ready Group has already been conducting rescue operations in the region, including eight medical evacuations and 148 airlifts, and delivered 44,177 pounds of relief supplies and cargo to Puerto Rico and the US Virgin Islands since Maria struck, according to the Pentagon.



    The US Air Force is also sending additional aircraft to Puerto Rico and the Virgin Islands to ramp up the volume of daily relief missions.

    http://www.cnn.com/2017/09/26/politics/us-military-response-puerto-rico-hurricane-maria/index.html
  • TarponatorTarponator Under a BridgePosts: 16,145 AG
    Angler719 wrote: »
    Sure they vote for statehood now that they need a 120 billion dollar bailout, now we have to completely rebuild the island.

    The vote was on June 11 of this year.

    Care to rethink that?
  • mustang190mustang190 Posts: 10,104 AG
    The Trump administration on Tuesday denied a request from several members of Congress to waive shipping restrictions to help get gasoline and other supplies to Puerto Rico as the island recovers from Hurricane Maria.

    McCain called the department's decision "unacceptable" and warned that Puerto Rico faces a humanitarian crisis as the island's 3.4 million people struggle to survive without power or clean water.

    Officials estimate the island could be without power for up to six months.

    "It is unacceptable to force the people of Puerto Rico to pay at least twice as much for food, clean drinking water, supplies and infrastructure due to Jones Act requirements as they work to recover from this disaster," McCain wrote.

    http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/352597-us-wont-waive-shipping-restrictions-for-puerto-rico-relief

    That's interesting except for one critical part, getting supplies there is no problem. The problem is that the ports are severally damaged.
    Just read a very good article on G Captain.com about it.
  • mustang190mustang190 Posts: 10,104 AG
    You just can't haul in supplies to an island. In order to land a C5 Galaxy the runways, ramps must be inspected first. Even smaller aircraft like a C130 needs forward logistics set up.
    The question that should be asked is what or where are the supplies and spare equipment that should have been in place long before this storm hit?
    The spare transformers, poles etc.
  • dragon baitdragon bait Posts: 8,454 Admiral
    San Juan Open with restrictions. Daylight hours only

    Guayanilla Port Readiness Condition IV. Open. Peerless Oil
    terminal open w/ restrictions, daylight
    operations only. Rest of port is open without
    restrictions

    https://energy.gov/sites/prod/files/2017/09/f36/Hurricanes%20Maria%2C%20Irma%20and%20Harvey%20Event%20Summary%20September%2025%2C%202017.pdf
  • NACl H2O LuvrNACl H2O Luvr Posts: 12,385 AG
    They lifted it for Fl after the stations ran out of gas


    On Monday, U.S. Representative Nydia Velázquez and seven other representatives asked Elaine Duke, acting head of Homeland Security, to waive the nearly 100-year-old shipping law for a year to help Puerto Rico recover from Hurricane Maria.Gregory Moore, a spokesman for Customs and Border Protection, an office of Homeland Security, said in a statement that an assessment by the agency showed there was “sufficient capacity” of U.S.-flagged vessels to move commodities to Puerto Rico.

    “The limitation is going to be port capacity to offload and transit, not vessel availability,” Moore said.

    The government’s rationale for a waiver after the storms hit Texas, Louisiana and Florida was to ease movement of fuel to places along the U.S. East Coast and make up for temporary outages of high capacity pipelines.

    “The situation in Puerto Rico is much different,” Moore said in the statement, adding that most of the humanitarian effort would be carried out with barges, which make up a large portion of the U.S. flagged cargo fleet.


    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-storm-maria-puertorico-shipping/u-s-denies-request-for-puerto-rico-shipping-waiver-idUSKCN1C12UI
  • Angler719Angler719 CrawfordvillePosts: 531 Officer
    Tarponator wrote: »
    The vote was on June 11 of this year.

    Care to rethink that?
    No, they have needed the financial bailout for a couple of years, they have actually voted against statehood since their financial problems begun. Now that bankruptcy is inevitable, they have decided to be a state. Coincidence? The storm is just another few billion in the grand scheme of things. I truly like the Island and the people. I did a lot of work in the hospitals in San Juan, Cauguas, and Arecibo and had a great time every time I was there.
  • FinfinderFinfinder Posts: 9,999 Admiral
    There will be a mass migration to the mainland soon, and they can register to vote in their new states as soon as they move.

    Since they already vote in primaries your post is just race baiting :trollnothing new.
    Tarponator wrote: »
    Did you really say that?

    Do you know they voted earlier this summer to become a state....and like 97% said yes. Does that sound like a group that doesn't want to be American?

    This place never ceases to amaze me.

    no it doesn't
  • TarponatorTarponator Under a BridgePosts: 16,145 AG
    Of course it doesn't.
  • FinfinderFinfinder Posts: 9,999 Admiral
    What exactly is your problem? no one is turning their backs on PR.
  • TarponatorTarponator Under a BridgePosts: 16,145 AG
    Misrepresentation of the truth & ignorance of the facts.
  • TarponatorTarponator Under a BridgePosts: 16,145 AG
    Angler719 wrote: »
    No, they have needed the financial bailout for a couple of years, they have actually voted against statehood since their financial problems begun. Now that bankruptcy is inevitable, they have decided to be a state. Coincidence? The storm is just another few billion in the grand scheme of things. I truly like the Island and the people. I did a lot of work in the hospitals in San Juan, Cauguas, and Arecibo and had a great time every time I was there.

    Nice moving goal posts.

    That said, you are simply incorrect about the history here -- they have voted for statehood since 2012 -- which explains in part how you can maintain a position that's so nonsensical.

    And it's not just the people of PR who have been asking for it. So have both US political parties and past presidents.

    Here's the history on the issue: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statehood_movement_in_Puerto_Rico

    But I guess that's all coincidence....
  • FinfinderFinfinder Posts: 9,999 Admiral
    Tarponator wrote: »
    Misrepresentation of the truth & ignorance of the facts.

    don't stop please elaborate ?
  • TarponatorTarponator Under a BridgePosts: 16,145 AG
    I already have.
  • FinfinderFinfinder Posts: 9,999 Admiral
    Tarponator wrote: »
    I already have.

    But you said this place never ceases to amaze you how so? Its a bad situation down there our country is making a serious effort to help weather they became a state or not .
  • Angler719Angler719 CrawfordvillePosts: 531 Officer
    Tarponator wrote: »
    Nice moving goal posts.

    That said, you are simply incorrect about the history here -- they have voted for statehood since 2012 -- which explains in part how you can maintain a position that's so nonsensical.

    And it's not just the people of PR who have been asking for it. So have both US political parties and past presidents.

    Here's the history on the issue: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statehood_movement_in_Puerto_Rico

    But I guess that's all coincidence....
    So you have google skills.
    10 years ago i was on the island working helping set up cancer centers that never opened. Why? Financial problems. Google all day, some of us have first hand knowledge of the island. Puerto Rico did not get in to a 120 billion dollar problem in 5 years. Go google some more
  • TarponatorTarponator Under a BridgePosts: 16,145 AG
    I have much more than Google skills, my friend. Are you new here?

    Nobody is disputing they have financial problems and nobody is suggesting they got into this problem in 5 years. I am simply disputing your two mistaken assertions attempting to link that debt to suddenly wanting statehood. Please try to keep up.

    And where did you get $120B from?
  • TarponatorTarponator Under a BridgePosts: 16,145 AG
    Finfinder wrote: »
    But you said this place never ceases to amaze you how so? Its a bad situation down there our country is making a serious effort to help weather they became a state or not .

    When I said "this place never ceases to amaze me", I was referring to Icecat21's post. Here it is again:
    Icecat21 wrote:
    Should have asked them a few weeks ago if they were Americans....

    Ask them now.

    Compare the answers.

    Come on, Fin, you're smarter than that.
  • FinfinderFinfinder Posts: 9,999 Admiral
    got you ......

    there are a couple others trying to politicize this and I think the US is doing what they can.
  • Angler719Angler719 CrawfordvillePosts: 531 Officer
    Tarponator wrote: »
    I have much more than Google skills, my friend. Are you new here?

    Nobody is disputing they have financial problems and nobody is suggesting they got into this problem in 5 years. I am simply disputing your two mistaken assertions attempting to link that debt to suddenly wanting statehood. Please try to keep up.

    And where did you get $120B from?

    Actually I am one of the original members here, joined within 30 days of florida sportsman joining the WWW. They have 70 billion in debt and 50 billion in pension commitments. I am almost sure you can add. Since you seem to think Wiki is a valid source.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puerto_Rican_government-debt_crisis
  • TarponatorTarponator Under a BridgePosts: 16,145 AG
    Thanks, and I guess that means you agree that Wiki is a valid source in this case.

    Tell me, who do you think is more fiscally responsible in terms of public debt, PR or the USA?

    Some friendly advice: You might want to google it before you stick your foot in your mouth again.
  • SAENoleSAENole Posts: 10,907 AG
    Warning Level 2
  • CyclistCyclist Posts: 23,346 AG
    Puerto Rico's problems? Caused by American greed of course...

    https://theintercept.com/2017/05/09/puerto-ricos-123-billion-bankruptcy-is-the-cost-of-u-s-colonialism/
    First, the colonial relationship that has prevailed between the U.S. and Puerto Rico since 1898 is no longer viable. Puerto Rico is the largest overseas territory still under the sovereign control of the United States, and it is the most important colonial possession in this nation’s history. That relationship produced uncommon profits for American subsidiaries on the island for more than a century, even as the federal government kept claiming that the Commonwealth of Puerto Rico, created in 1952, was a self-governing territory. But now, with a Washington-appointed board directly overseeing the island’s economy, and with a pivotal Supreme Court decision last year affirming that Congress continues to exercise sovereign power over Puerto Rico, the mask of self-governance has been removed.

    https://www.thenation.com/article/who-is-responsible-for-puerto-ricos-debt/
    Who Is Responsible for Puerto Rico’s Debt?
    There’s evidence some of it is illegal—and activists agree that Washington’s colonial control over the island’s economy helped create the crisis.

    Who Is Responsible?

    What progressives in the United States and Puerto Rico agree on is that pressure must be put on Washington to own up to its responsibility in the debt crisis. Washington’s colonial control over the country’s economy helped create this situation; UCLA professor César Ayala says that Puerto Rico would rank next to last on a list of world countries in GNP-to-GDP ratio. Only $67 billion out of the island’s $100 billion in earnings stays in Puerto Rico. Ayala estimates that between 2004 and 2013, US multinationals repatriated $313 billion from Puerto Rico, which is enough to repay the debt fourfold.

    This loss of generated wealth, in which Puerto Ricans are a captive market for consumer goods sold by Walmart, fast-food chains, and the like, has translated into the need for government borrowing, which was sold to US pension holders without any understanding of the artificial and insolvent nature of Puerto Rico’s economy. Even as the debt piled up, corporate profits for pharmaceutical companies like Pfizer, which has major operations in Puerto Rico, continued unabated. In late May, another Big Pharma brand, Roche, announced it was investing $60 million to increase production on the island, creating a whopping 40 jobs in the process. “While Puerto Rico was going into debt, and its creditors could receive payments, Congress did not worry,” said law professor Ramos. “When the moment came when this could no longer be done, then PR is irresponsible.”

    While everyone agrees there is a shared responsibility for the crisis, and that a series of elected Puerto Rican governments played a role in continuing to amass debt, it can also be argued that they had no choice and were acting much like many US state governments and municipalities in recent years. Such an obvious failure should not be a reason for Puerto Ricans on the island or on the mainland to accept the odious imposition of PROMESA’s fiscal-oversight board. Of course, even if the bill passes the House, it could be softened in the Senate. But for now, there is a growing consensus, among mainstream politicians and grassroots activists here and on the island, that it must be rejected, and that Congress is gravely mistaken if it thinks this will save Puerto Rico.
  • mindyabinessmindyabiness Posts: 5,890 Admiral
    Arguing with idiots is like playing chess with a pigeon... No matter how good you are, the bird is going to crap on the board and strut around like it won anyway.
  • Angler719Angler719 CrawfordvillePosts: 531 Officer
    Tarponator wrote: »
    Thanks, and I guess that means you agree that Wiki is a valid source in this case.

    Tell me, who do you think is more fiscally responsible in terms of public debt, PR or the USA?

    Some friendly advice: You might want to google it before you stick your foot in your mouth again.

    No need to google that the US government has been much more irresponsible , especially the last eight years.
    Read that wiki and see who has cut Puerto Ricos throat, you probably wont like what you find.

    Oh I wouldn't take your advice for anything, My toilet paper is probably worth more.
  • Angler719Angler719 CrawfordvillePosts: 531 Officer
    At this point you wont be talking to me , you are no longer worth my time.
  • CyclistCyclist Posts: 23,346 AG

    From your source.
    The Intercept produces well sourced quality journalism.

    I have never heard of them before or read anything by them. Figured they may offer a less conservative view than the nation, although both sources seem to say similar things. Colonialism is a major issue with PR.
  • gettinwetgettinwet Posts: 1,366 Officer
    Icecat21 wrote: »
    Should have asked them a few weeks ago if they were Americans....

    Ask them now.

    Compare the answers.

    Because that is complicated - lots of tax incentives given to corporations and related to bond sales which led to the financial predicament the US territory is experiencing now and if PR becomes a state they would go away exacerbating the problem. Once again, big money talks!
    There are only so many casts in life, so shut up and fish!!
Sign In or Register to comment.