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Who does the Gulf Council members represent?

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Replies

  • Tom HiltonTom Hilton Posts: 1,595 Captain
    Like you said, you are not an attorney.
  • notreelynotreely Posts: 653 Officer
    Tom Hilton wrote: »
    Like you said, you are not an attorney.
  • Tom HiltonTom Hilton Posts: 1,595 Captain
    Looks like desperation when you attempt to justify their actions, with the limited legal knowledge you have.

    There's a LOT more to this than has been revealed at this point - I suggest you wait and see what comes out of this before you embarrass yourself any further.
  • notreelynotreely Posts: 653 Officer
    Tom Hilton wrote: »
    Looks like desperation when you attempt to justify their actions, with the limited legal knowledge you have.

    There's a LOT more to this than has been revealed at this point - I suggest you wait and see what comes out of this before you embarrass yourself any further.

    Why am I embarrassing myself? I precluded my opinion with the fact that I'm not a legal expert.
    I commented on what was not revealed in the letter and my interpretation of the regulation.
    If there is more to this and it is revealed maybe it will change my mind. As to what's been revealed, it reeks of desperation!
  • notreely wrote: »
    Why am I embarrassing myself? I precluded my opinion ...

    :grin You are not a grammaticist either.
    "If I can't win, I won't play." - Doris Colecchio.

    "Well Gary, the easiest way to look tall is to stand in a room full of short people." - Curtis Bostick

    "All these forums, with barely any activity, are like a neglected old cemetery that no one visits anymore."- anonymouse
  • notreelynotreely Posts: 653 Officer
    :grin You are not a grammaticist either.

    I know it's my florida public school education. What state were you educated in.
  • Please to not attempt to blame Florida for your ineptitude in written communication.

    What was your name again?
    "If I can't win, I won't play." - Doris Colecchio.

    "Well Gary, the easiest way to look tall is to stand in a room full of short people." - Curtis Bostick

    "All these forums, with barely any activity, are like a neglected old cemetery that no one visits anymore."- anonymouse
  • notreelynotreely Posts: 653 Officer
    Please to not attempt to blame Florida for your ineptitude in written communication.

    What was your name again?

    Ahh, ya doesn’t has to call me Johnson! You can call me Ray, or you can call me Jay, or you can call me Johnny or you can call me Sonny, or you can call me RayJay, or you can call me RJ… but ya doesn’t hafta call me Johnson
  • harbisonharbison Posts: 5,621 Admiral
    "There's a LOT more to this than has been revealed at this point" Exactly! But then again when has king NOAA ever had to justify, reveal, anything?
    As far as public schools & writing skills...I tutored studends preparing for 'Florida Writes.' Some were very good; some not so good. Wish the public school system was more demanding.
    On a personal level, I am a product of a Jesuit & University of Tampa education; that's a whole different ball game.
    Would be very interesting to see the backgrounds of all those affiliated with NOAA. In addition, we need to know exactly how far EDF has infiltrated into our fishery. EDF has proven to be a strong proponent of sector separation. The gulf council approved sector separation even when their own web sight received a 96.3% public comment opposition rate. It appears to be very obvious who the council actually represents.
  • notreelynotreely Posts: 653 Officer
    Where did you go to public school Gary?
  • My degree in this stuff is from Florida Institute of Technology.

    Where did you receive yours and what is your name?
    "If I can't win, I won't play." - Doris Colecchio.

    "Well Gary, the easiest way to look tall is to stand in a room full of short people." - Curtis Bostick

    "All these forums, with barely any activity, are like a neglected old cemetery that no one visits anymore."- anonymouse
  • notreelynotreely Posts: 653 Officer
    My degree in this stuff is from Florida Institute of Technology.

    Where did you receive yours and what is your name?

    On the water and you can call me what ever you want!
    What state did you go to grammar school in?
  • Tom HiltonTom Hilton Posts: 1,595 Captain
    Speaks volumes about a person's character when he refuses to put his name behind what he says, while simultaneously attacking people who dare to stand behind what they say with their name and reputation.
  • notreelynotreely Posts: 653 Officer
    Tom Hilton wrote: »
    Speaks volumes about a person's character when he refuses to put his name behind what he says, while simultaneously attacking people who dare to stand behind what they say with their name and reputation.

    I neither care what you think of me or desire to know other members names. This a forum,it is a place to exchange views and ideas about our fisheries. When this forum requires me to give my identity I might do that.
    I realize that asking me who I am is your fallback position and that says volumes about you.
  • harbisonharbison Posts: 5,621 Admiral
    Wow! A whole new meaning for 'beating around the bush!'
    "Speaks volumes about a person's character when he refuses to put his name behind what he says," Good point! Tom, I taught my students to always include their name whenever expressing their points of view; ALWAYS be courteous & professional.
  • Tom HiltonTom Hilton Posts: 1,595 Captain
    I guess Notreely feels that I was referring to him for some reason - just making a general statement really.
  • notreely wrote: »
    As I've said before, I'm not a attorney.
    I wonder why the letter doesn't show the whole regulation.


    109-479 (2) Each affected individual must disclose any financial interest held by— (A) that individual; (B) the spouse, minor child, or partner of that individual; and (C) any organization (other than the Council) in which that individual is serving as an officer, director, trustee, partner, or employee; in any harvesting, processing, lobbying, advocacy, or marketing activity that is being, or will be, undertaken within any fishery over which the Council concerned has jurisdiction, or with respect to an individual or organization with a financial interest in such activity.

    It would seem if the individuals were not being paid by this organization ( financial intrest) their is nothing to disclose.

    Goes well beyond financial interest. Even non paid disclosure has its place. In this case where Council members are not allowed to lobby congress directly, being on the board of a commercial seafood lobby group is certainly a conflict. The fact that (2) of them supposedly did disclose such, at some unknown point in time, and it simply was not posted on the Councils website, indicates that at least someone involved thought it was a conflict worth noting. Additionally the fact that they are now taking the matter up with general council shows their is some question about it. Of coarse, asking internal GC to weigh in on it is like asking the Fox to guard the Hen House....the outcome is already known.
  • notreelynotreely Posts: 653 Officer
    Goes well beyond financial interest. Even non paid disclosure has its place. In this case where Council members are not allowed to lobby congress directly, being on the board of a commercial seafood lobby group is certainly a conflict. The fact that (2) of them supposedly did disclose such, at some unknown point in time, and it simply was not posted on the Councils website, indicates that at least someone involved thought it was a conflict worth noting. Additionally the fact that they are now taking the matter up with general council shows their is some question about it. Of coarse, asking internal GC to weigh in on it is like asking the Fox to guard the Hen House....the outcome is already known.

    The council received a letter from the FRA legal counsel, who would you like them to take it up with their janitor. The letter sent by the FRA specifically mentioned faliure to disclose "financial intrest". I did not read any other claim in the letter you posted the link to, accusing those council members with anything else.
  • notreely wrote: »
    The council received a letter from the FRA legal counsel, who would you like them to take it up with their janitor. The letter sent by the FRA specifically mentioned faliure to disclose "financial intrest". I did not read any other claim in the letter you posted the link to, accusing those council members with anything else.

    1)GSI is a known lobby group for the commercial seafood industry.
    2)Council members are not allowed to lobby Congress.
    3)3 active council members are on GSI's board, paid or not.
    4)Despite disclosure requirements, at least 2 members have been GSI board members over a year
    and were just now hearing about their disclosure being posted in the near future? Sound like
    a scramble to fix a huge blunder? Consequences?
    5)NOAA has a COI rule about any of its agents doing nothing that could lead to distrust.

    Does any of this NOT sound like a very real conflict of interest?
  • notreelynotreely Posts: 653 Officer
    1)GSI is a known lobby group for the commercial seafood industry.
    2)Council members are not allowed to lobby Congress.
    3)3 active council members are on GSI's board, paid or not.
    4)Despite disclosure requirements, at least 2 members have been GSI board members over a year
    and were just now hearing about their disclosure being posted in the near future? Sound like
    a scramble to fix a huge blunder? Consequences?
    5)NOAA has a COI rule about any of its agents doing nothing that could lead to distrust.

    Does any of this NOT sound like a very real conflict of interest?

    I am not claiming to know all the ins and outs about this. I do have my questions about yours and others opinions.
    The council as body is not allowed to lobby congress, Im not sure if that applies to individual council members.
    I don't know if expressing your individual opinion is considered lobbying. If being a member of an organization that lobby's congress is a violation, then I guess former chairman and current council member Boyd is also in violation of the regulation since he is involved with the leadership of the CCA.
    I still think that financial intrest is the most relevant issue
  • notreelynotreely Posts: 653 Officer
    I stand corrected!
  • harbisonharbison Posts: 5,621 Admiral
    "I stand corrected!" If we take the time, and are willing to, we can all learn a great deal from each other. Knowledge is power!
  • TypicleseTypiclese Posts: 393 Deckhand
    Bob,

    If you want to know how much they are paid, file a FOIA request. Unless they work for DoD, CIA, FBI or in the White House, this information should be available from a FOIA.

    Try this website, it might work. If not, go the FOIA route.
    http://www.wusa9.com/story/local/2012/05/14/3947123/
  • harbisonharbison Posts: 5,621 Admiral
    Thanks! Will look into it. Just thought it would be interesting to see how much we are paying them to represent whom ever they represent.
  • With 3 current Gulf Council members and other former GC members on GIS's board, thought it would be
    appropriate to see what they stand for and who they represent. Here is a recent introduction from GSI
    before a Gulf Council meeting last year, at a time when at least 2 of their own were sitting on the council.
    Its also important that GSI fellow board members were part of the lawsuit that is such a hot topic in what
    it did to recreational access. These very council members as GSI representatives also walked the halls of DC
    advocating their groups position...Lobbying. These are 3 of the Gulf Councils current council members.

    http://gulfseafoodinstitute.org/207/gulf-seafood-institute-gulf-of-mexico-fishery-management-council/
  • BubbaIIBubbaII Posts: 328 Deckhand
    harbison wrote: »
    Thanks! Will look into it. Just thought it would be interesting to see how much we are paying them to represent whom ever they represent.

    somewhere, way back on page 1 or 2, I noted that Council budget is available on their web site. No need to FOIA. Ever since then, this thread had degenerated into a "he said" "she said" debacle.

    I noted a long time ago, that as a moderator on a board on the other side of the internet, any thread that gets this long, has lost its purpose, and is dead. This thread has had grammar arguments, the classic Gary "who are you?" repetition, etc. Any function to this thread died after about page 3. I'm surprised that our new moderator doesn't realize this.
  • BubbaII wrote: »
    somewhere, way back on page 1 or 2, I noted that Council budget is available on their web site. No need to FOIA. Ever since then, this thread had degenerated into a "he said" "she said" debacle.

    I noted a long time ago, that as a moderator on a board on the other side of the internet, any thread that gets this long, has lost its purpose, and is dead. This thread has had grammar arguments, the classic Gary "who are you?" repetition, etc. Any function to this thread died after about page 3. I'm surprised that our new moderator doesn't realize this.

    I am actually a very "old" moderator, being the first and reluctantly returning to the position as asked. What did you say your name was?
    "If I can't win, I won't play." - Doris Colecchio.

    "Well Gary, the easiest way to look tall is to stand in a room full of short people." - Curtis Bostick

    "All these forums, with barely any activity, are like a neglected old cemetery that no one visits anymore."- anonymouse
  • CountryBumpkinCountryBumpkin Fla. Piney WoodsPosts: 1,893 Captain
    BubbaII wrote: »
    I noted a long time ago, that as a moderator on a board on the other side of the internet, any thread that gets this long, has lost its purpose, and is dead. This thread has had grammar arguments, the classic Gary "who are you?" repetition, etc. Any function to this thread died after about page 3. I'm surprised that our new moderator doesn't realize this.

    I noted a long time ago that any thread be it long or short, varying on and off topic, humorous or mundane........ If that thread eventually gets around to actually demonstrating with some proof or links someone can go off and research on their own, the dastardly deeds that lobbyist and paid shrills are doing to hijack our fisheries management system............ well then along comes you to discredit it and claim it should be locked down or holds no value or merit to the forum.

    Does it upset you that we don't like crooks and unethical dealings?:grin
  • drgibbydrgibby Posts: 1,938 Captain
    I noted a long time ago that any thread be it long or short, varying on and off topic, humorous or mundane........ If that thread eventually gets around to actually demonstrating with some proof or links someone can go off and research on their own, the dastardly deeds that lobbyist and paid shrills are doing to hijack our fisheries management system............ well then along comes you to discredit it and claim it should be locked down or holds no value or merit to the forum.

    Does it upset you that we don't like crooks and unethical dealings?:grin

    Very well said. Too bad there was not a Forum run by those that exploit our salty resources for personal financial gain. It would be fun to play antagonist on such a site!
  • harbisonharbison Posts: 5,621 Admiral
    :USA " any thread that gets this long, has lost its purpose, and is dead." Sounds like an EDF intervention. Who else could possibly claim that a thread with 2,127 visitors & growing every hour is "dead?" That, along with 89+ reasponses, proves differently.
    This thread has turned into a real learning tool. Thanks to all who have contributed, thanks to Gary for, once again, assuming the moderator position. F/S needs moderators who know what they are doing, and thanks to F/S for the support!
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