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  • Ol MuckyOl Mucky Posts: 5,603 Admiral
    the council and NMFS are also in the process of implementing regulations that will allow any us citizen to purchase red snapper shares/allocation beginning January 1 2012
    I have a much bigger and more powerful button
  • Got TA GoGot TA Go Posts: 2,608 Captain
    Ol Mucky wrote: »
    the council and NMFS are also in the process of implementing regulations that will allow any us citizen to purchase red snapper shares/allocation beginning January 1 2012

    If I understand that rule correctly, it only applies to holders of Federal Gulf Reef Permits, not general public.

    Rob
    www.gottagofishinginkeywest.com


    Hero's Don't Wear Capes....They Wear Dog Tags.
  • FletchFletch Merritt Island, FLPosts: 2,558 Moderator
    I'm not so sure about that Rob. What you've stated is already the current situation. Five years after implementation of the IFQ program, the shares were provisioned to be available for anyone to purchase. Their are some restrictions but I'm pretty sure they don't require the purchaser to also own a reef permit.
    "Ninety percent I'll spend on good times, women and Irish whiskey. The other ten percent, I'll probably waste..."
    -- Tug McGraw on getting a raise

    Get Down Fishing Charters - Port Canaveral, Florida
  • The question as to whether or not the general public may participate in shares purchese
    and trading may be intentionally unclear. It may well be that NOAA's employing what PEW
    and EDF are doing to promote fishery policy, and this is basically a game of "Bait and
    Switch". NOAA leaving the 'details' murky, allows them the flexibility to make it what
    ever they want, once installed. Its another example of Catch Shares mentality the the
    EDF funded groups are pushing, 'Vote for it now, and we will take care of the details Later'!

    NOAA just announced an Atlantic Shark Catch Share program Notice of Intent. Like usual,
    details are not clear. In the NOI, the did list a Sept 16, 2011 control date, so it appears
    that this is primarily intended for HMS permit holders. Is this Commercial only, or is CFH
    included? Does this include Sharks only, or as hinted at all HMS permitted spescis, including
    billfish and tuna's? Who knows with NOAA.
  • Capt EasyCapt Easy Posts: 203 Officer
    The question as to whether or not the general public may participate in shares purchese
    and trading may be intentionally unclear. It may well be that NOAA's employing what PEW
    and EDF are doing to promote fishery policy, and this is basically a game of "Bait and
    Switch". NOAA leaving the 'details' murky, allows them the flexibility to make it what
    ever they want, once installed. Its another example of Catch Shares mentality the the
    EDF funded groups are pushing, 'Vote for it now, and we will take care of the details Later'!

    NOAA just announced an Atlantic Shark Catch Share program Notice of Intent. Like usual,
    details are not clear. In the NOI, the did list a Sept 16, 2011 control date, so it appears
    that this is primarily intended for HMS permit holders. Is this Commercial only, or is CFH
    included? Does this include Sharks only, or as hinted at all HMS permitted spescis, including
    billfish and tuna's? Who knows with NOAA.

    I think it's odd that non fisherman will be able to buy snapper shares.

    It's all about sharks. The details do remain to be worked out, including weather or not any recs would be involved. How it is to be carried out is all open at this time. The details to be hashed out among stakeholders and then decided by NMFS.
  • ANUMBER1ANUMBER1 Posts: 12,731 AG
    Yes, at the current time non permit holders will be able to purchase snapper shares in 2012 but change is a coming...maybe:rolleyes
    I am glad to only be a bird hunter with bird dogs...being a shooter or dog handler or whatever other niche exists to separate appears to generate far too much about which to worry.
  • Capt Easy wrote: »
    It's all about sharks. The details do remain to be worked out, including weather or not any recs would be involved. How it is to be carried out is all open at this time. The details to be hashed out among stakeholders and then decided by NMFS.

    The subject is listed as a Shark measure, but it is tied ti HMS permit holders. Will they seperate sharks out of the
    HMS permits for seperate control, or add Billfish and Tuna's to the proposed Catch Share program as a
    package "Share" program, like the proposed Gulf "Reef Fish" program. This is of coarse a big problem, in
    that CS promoters want to pass the measure, and then fill in the details later. Hashing it out among stakeholders
    is what NOAA allow's, yet they still continue to do pretty much whatever they want. Granted they give some
    flexibility to those that go along with their schemes, but for the majority its, "Take it or get out"!

    Given what has happened with Catch Shares everywhere they have been pushed in, does anyone really
    want this? Those that EDF funds seemed guarenteed a paycheck, but what about everyone else? And much
    like the whole catch share myth, how can any program exist and be managed without the data? NOAA has
    run with the notion that "Landing" data can count as a measure of the fisheries health, and as such be used to
    determine sustainable catch limits. This myth certainly does not meet the scientific test, but that seems
    to be the norm with an agency determined to push its agenda at all cost.

    EDF and PEW is opposed to legislation that would require Accurate and Current data for setting Catch Limits.
    NOAA is silent, but you know Jane likes the Status-Quo also. How else could she justify imposing new programs
    if we had real data to prove nothing was needed. Even Catch Share supporters refuse to respond to the data
    issue, because they know if Biomass data was avalible, sustainable catch limits could be set, and EVERYONE
    COULD FISH!!!
  • Tom HiltonTom Hilton Posts: 1,595 Captain
    The NMFS needs to be dismantled and shut down - permanently - and the management of the fisheries deferred to the STATES, who have proven to be ever more able to manage our fisheries than the feds.

    2012 can't get here soon enough! It's sad that many of our CFH friends, who you would think would be conservative, will be voting FOR Obama this next election cycle.

    PERRY 2012

    I FISH / I VOTE!


    Capt. Thomas J. Hilton
  • Ol MuckyOl Mucky Posts: 5,603 Admiral
    Tom Hilton wrote: »
    The NMFS needs to be dismantled and shut down - permanently - and the management of the fisheries deferred to the STATES, who have proven to be ever more able to manage our fisheries than the feds.

    2012 can't get here soon enough! It's sad that many of our CFH friends, who you would think would be conservative, will be voting FOR Obama this next election cycle.

    PERRY 2012

    I FISH / I VOTE!




    Capt. Thomas J. Hilton

    Just like the fella in the WH was able to push through a failure of a healthcare project.. my guess is NMFS and the WH will push through this garbage asap, and work out the details later. H will be out of the WH but his god-awful legacy will remain.
    I have a much bigger and more powerful button
  • Got TA GoGot TA Go Posts: 2,608 Captain
    Odd how the people of the South Atlantic management area sent the message of a resounding "NO" to Catch Shares, and it looked as if the SAFMC actually heard it and were going to drop the discussion....

    Now I read:

    "South Atlantic Snapper Grouper: At their March 2011 meeting, the South Atlantic Council decided to postpone development of Amendment 21 – Comprehensive Catch Shares Amendment – that was being developed to consider catch shares for the Snapper Grouper fisheries. While not actively working on this amendment, the Council approved distribution of a share-allocation calculator that has been developed to allow fishermen to evaluate the amount of shares/pounds they would receive under various initial distribution scenarios. The calculator will be distributed later this summer."

    So it looks that they want to take another approach and wave dollar bills in front of the Comm guys faces and say...this is how much you could have....

    I wonder who "developed" the "Share-Allocation Calculator". :Angry

    Rob
    www.gottagofishinginkeywest.com


    Hero's Don't Wear Capes....They Wear Dog Tags.
  • FletchFletch Merritt Island, FLPosts: 2,558 Moderator
    Yeah I saw that too. Good God NOAA, NMFS and the councils need an enema.
    "Ninety percent I'll spend on good times, women and Irish whiskey. The other ten percent, I'll probably waste..."
    -- Tug McGraw on getting a raise

    Get Down Fishing Charters - Port Canaveral, Florida
  • GT FishGT Fish Posts: 9,448 Officer
    Excuse my ignorance,but what exactly are catch shares? How do they work?
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  • THERE SHOULD BE NO COMMERCIAL FISHING ALLOWED FOR ANY SPECIES THAT IS CONSIDERED OVERFISHED.
  • GT FishGT Fish Posts: 9,448 Officer

    Here is your link status?

    Sorry - no matches. Please try some different terms.
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  • saltybradsaltybrad Posts: 502 Officer
    GT Fish wrote: »
    Excuse my ignorance,but what exactly are catch shares? How do they work?

    Basically the pound of fish you expect to catch and keep will first have to be purchased through a commodity trading system. Non fishermen and special interests could corner entire specie allocations, thus pricing out any recreationals from the chance to keep any fish at all.
  • GT FishGT Fish Posts: 9,448 Officer
    saltybrad wrote: »
    Basically the pound of fish you expect to catch and keep will first have to be purchased through a commodity trading system. Non fishermen and special interests could corner entire specie allocations, thus pricing out any recreationals from the chance to keep any fish at all.

    They could do whatever they think..I'll smuggle my fish back in... ;)
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  • GT Fish wrote: »
    Here is your link status?

    Sorry - no matches. Please try some different terms.

    Try this one:
    http://forums.floridasportsman.com/search.php?searchid=224225

    I checked the one I posted yesterday, don't know why it's not working now.
    Either way, I just typed "catch shares" in the search box and it came up with the above link which has tons of threads and info on the topic.
    THERE SHOULD BE NO COMMERCIAL FISHING ALLOWED FOR ANY SPECIES THAT IS CONSIDERED OVERFISHED.
  • Got TA GoGot TA Go Posts: 2,608 Captain

    "Sorry - no matches. Please try some different terms."
    www.gottagofishinginkeywest.com


    Hero's Don't Wear Capes....They Wear Dog Tags.
  • Got TA GoGot TA Go Posts: 2,608 Captain
    GT Fish wrote: »
    Excuse my ignorance,but what exactly are catch shares? How do they work?

    Here's a link that this questions was discussed:

    http://forums.floridasportsman.com/showthread.php?3046-Catch-Shares-can-someone-explain&highlight=Catch+Shares

    And like MS said, if you type "Catch Shares" into the search box at the top/right-hand side of the screen (on FSFF), you'll get about 3 pages of threads on this subject in various stages and coming from various angles. The link he's trying to post is to his search vs a specific link. :wink

    Rob
    www.gottagofishinginkeywest.com


    Hero's Don't Wear Capes....They Wear Dog Tags.
  • :facepalm
    Some times I am such an internet dumazz:red
    THERE SHOULD BE NO COMMERCIAL FISHING ALLOWED FOR ANY SPECIES THAT IS CONSIDERED OVERFISHED.
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