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What would you do? GOod deal on solar voltaic

CaptTaterCaptTater Posts: 20,096 AG
I have a chance to buy a 10KW solar system plus 2kw solar water heater for $35k vs the $60k quoted last year. It's a 1yr old used system being removed from a building the owner is vacating. After tax credits and such I will be out $15k come tax time but it will take 8yrs to recoup the difference with the low estimate on KWh per month produced.

Worth it? I assume it would also add to the value of the house?

I give some value to sticking it up Psycholists nose who burns wood for heat in the most inefficient way possible producing a lot of CO2 and soot.
I did not read the story but if you take tax payers money maybe you should be held to some standards.-Cyclist
when we say the same thing about welfare recipients, you cry like a wounded buffalo Sopchoppy
It's their money, they spend it how they like. Truth and honesty have nothing to do with it. - Mr Jr
"“A radical is one who advocates sweeping changes in the existing laws and methods of government.” "
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Replies

  • razorreilly09razorreilly09 Posts: 8,401 Admiral
    It would only add value if you are thinking selling in the near future. Other than that, think of maintenance.
  • launchpadlaunchpad Posts: 386 Officer
    pass. even at being out 15K the system wont pay itsellf off before replacemnt. Solar just ain't there yet
    "When you get to the end of your rope, tie a knot and hang on." Franklin D. Roosevelt
  • HoltHolt Posts: 972 Officer
    As much as I know you would like to rub the nose of enviromentalwackos in your green system. No. Don't give in. I am sure without even researching it that you would end up being sorry for buying it. How did Obummers green stimulis company's work out?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • 001001 Posts: 4,292 Captain
    launchpad wrote: »
    pass. even at being out 15K the system wont pay itsellf off before replacemnt. Solar just ain't there yet

    This is what I was thinking. 8 years to break even and hopefully it will still be working like it should for many years after that.
  • jad1097jad1097 Posts: 9,611 Admiral
    What has to be replaced, the batteries? The panels should last 20+ years.

    FOr the price it seems like a good deal.
  • HomerSimpsonHomerSimpson Posts: 6,573 Admiral
    jad1097 wrote: »
    What has to be replaced, the batteries? The panels should last 20+ years.

    FOr the price it seems like a good deal.

    I looked into this a few years back. The panels, new, are only like 80% effeicient and they loose effeciency over the years. This affects payback, but typically not included in the figures.

    Don't know if its still true or not.
  • Mackeral SnatcherMackeral Snatcher Posts: 11,621 AG
    How much is the yearly upkeep and maintenance?
    THERE SHOULD BE NO COMMERCIAL FISHING ALLOWED FOR ANY SPECIES THAT IS CONSIDERED OVERFISHED.
  • HomerSimpsonHomerSimpson Posts: 6,573 Admiral
    I would do it, if you had the money, from a prepper standpoint. Living in florida, the question is more like when and for how long, not if, the power goes out. So being prepared to live off the grid is a good thing. However, will that system survive a storm?

    Gas generators are not a good long term power outage solution.
  • CaptTaterCaptTater Posts: 20,096 AG
    Here's the crappy part about solar in Florida. The grid tied have to shut off if the grid is gone. Now that doesn't mean it can't be easily overridden but there must be a place to store/dissipate the excess production. That's not a huge obstacle but a "too bad" it doesn't just work.
    I did not read the story but if you take tax payers money maybe you should be held to some standards.-Cyclist
    when we say the same thing about welfare recipients, you cry like a wounded buffalo Sopchoppy
    It's their money, they spend it how they like. Truth and honesty have nothing to do with it. - Mr Jr
    "“A radical is one who advocates sweeping changes in the existing laws and methods of government.” "
  • nuclearfishnnuclearfishn Posts: 8,356 Admiral
    I heard the voltaic panels lose anywhere from 0.5-1% effeciency per year. I think if that is true you would have to factor that into the longterm.
  • Triple Threat 33TTriple Threat 33T Port CanaveralPosts: 18,669 Admin
    The parts are cheap Tater. Build your own
    "Lord, hold our troops in your loving hands. Protect them as they protect us. Bless them and their families for the selfless acts they perform for us in our time of need. Amen."
  • HomerSimpsonHomerSimpson Posts: 6,573 Admiral
    The parts are cheap Tater. Build your own

    yea, you could probably offer cycle boy a 6-pack to come help you build one this weekend. That would be a nice bonding experience for both ya
  • CaptTaterCaptTater Posts: 20,096 AG
    the cheapest I found the parts for is $25k. They do lose efficiency but the measure output is actually way over the rating. There is a way for the systems to be online monitored and we looked at a 10KW system about 2 miles away that's producing nearly 14KW during the day. That reduced output is factored in.
    I did not read the story but if you take tax payers money maybe you should be held to some standards.-Cyclist
    when we say the same thing about welfare recipients, you cry like a wounded buffalo Sopchoppy
    It's their money, they spend it how they like. Truth and honesty have nothing to do with it. - Mr Jr
    "“A radical is one who advocates sweeping changes in the existing laws and methods of government.” "
  • century7century7 Posts: 2,410 Captain
    I would pass. I remember during Wilma those things did not stay on the roof and were tossed about like toys. I know with some systems you can pump unused electriciy back in to the grid and get paid back. Will this system allow you to do that? The technology just is not there yet.
    It works 60% of the time all the time......
  • CaptTaterCaptTater Posts: 20,096 AG
    Yes it will pump back and FPL is required to buy it.
    I did not read the story but if you take tax payers money maybe you should be held to some standards.-Cyclist
    when we say the same thing about welfare recipients, you cry like a wounded buffalo Sopchoppy
    It's their money, they spend it how they like. Truth and honesty have nothing to do with it. - Mr Jr
    "“A radical is one who advocates sweeping changes in the existing laws and methods of government.” "
  • CaptTaterCaptTater Posts: 20,096 AG
    He sweetened the deal. Added a variable speed pool pump motor and will hook up my solar pool heater I've yet to connect.
    I did not read the story but if you take tax payers money maybe you should be held to some standards.-Cyclist
    when we say the same thing about welfare recipients, you cry like a wounded buffalo Sopchoppy
    It's their money, they spend it how they like. Truth and honesty have nothing to do with it. - Mr Jr
    "“A radical is one who advocates sweeping changes in the existing laws and methods of government.” "
  • CyclistCyclist Posts: 23,346 AG
    I have a friend with a similar sounding system on a large modern house with all the amenities. He breaks even on electric every month. He is also not planning on leaving the house any time soon.
  • CyclistCyclist Posts: 23,346 AG
    I looked into this a few years back. The panels, new, are only like 80% effeicient and they loose effeciency over the years. This affects payback, but typically not included in the figures.

    Don't know if its still true or not.

    As opposed to what. That is a pretty good number.
  • CaptTaterCaptTater Posts: 20,096 AG
    I don't think there are any 80% efficient panels. More like 10-15%
    I did not read the story but if you take tax payers money maybe you should be held to some standards.-Cyclist
    when we say the same thing about welfare recipients, you cry like a wounded buffalo Sopchoppy
    It's their money, they spend it how they like. Truth and honesty have nothing to do with it. - Mr Jr
    "“A radical is one who advocates sweeping changes in the existing laws and methods of government.” "
  • HomerSimpsonHomerSimpson Posts: 6,573 Admiral
    Cyclist wrote: »
    As opposed to what. That is a pretty good number.

    as opposed to what they are designed to do. So if you buy a 100-watt panel you are only getting 80 watts from day one (out of the box)
  • treemanjohntreemanjohn Posts: 5,024 Admiral
    He's taking it out of a building being vacated. I would offer $10k in cash. He'll take it
    We’re like the piggy bank that everybody is robbing, and that ends
  • CyclistCyclist Posts: 23,346 AG
    as opposed to what they are designed to do. So if you buy a 100-watt panel you are only getting 80 watts from day one (out of the box)

    TABLE 4-2
    Efficiencies of common energy conversion devices
    Energy Conversion Device Energy Conversion Typical
    Efficiency, %
    Electric heater Electricity/Thermal 100
    Hair drier Electricity/Thermal 100
    Electric generator Mechanical/Electricity 95
    Electric motor (large) Electricity/Mechanical 90
    Battery Chemical/Electricity 90
    Steam boiler (power plant) Chemical/Thermal 85
    Home gas furnace Chemical/Thermal 85
    Home oil furnace Chemical/Thermal 65
    Electric motor (small) Electricity/Mechanical 65
    Home coal furnace Chemical/Thermal 55
    Steam turbine Thermal/Mechanical 45
    Gas turbine (aircraft) Chemical/Mechanical 35
    Gas turbine (industrial) Chemical/Mechanical 30
    Automobile engine Chemical/Mechanical 25
    Fluorescent lamp Electricity/Light 20
    Silicon solar cell Solar/Electricity 15
    Steam locomotive Chemical/Mechanical 10
    Incandescent lamp Electricity/Light 5
    Heat
  • MadScientistMadScientist Posts: 3,402 Officer
    I would think just having those on your roof, even if they did not work, would save you a lot of money on AC.

    Also, did you factor in for rising energy costs when you did your amortization? I'm, sure that you electric bill would be a lot higher in 8 years than it is now.
  • CaptTaterCaptTater Posts: 20,096 AG
    He's taking it out of a building being vacated. I would offer $10k in cash. He'll take it

    Not his building. A company he sold it to. He's buying it back from them.. Well, I'm buying it back from them.
    THis just took a turn for the shady when I google searched his name.
    I did not read the story but if you take tax payers money maybe you should be held to some standards.-Cyclist
    when we say the same thing about welfare recipients, you cry like a wounded buffalo Sopchoppy
    It's their money, they spend it how they like. Truth and honesty have nothing to do with it. - Mr Jr
    "“A radical is one who advocates sweeping changes in the existing laws and methods of government.” "
  • CaptTaterCaptTater Posts: 20,096 AG
    I would think just having those on your roof, even if they did not work, would save you a lot of money on AC.

    Also, did you factor in for rising energy costs when you did your amortization? I'm, sure that you electric bill would be a lot higher in 8 years than it is now.
    I think as well it should shade the roof. THey have an air gap.
    Yes the increased cost of electric is included.
    I did not read the story but if you take tax payers money maybe you should be held to some standards.-Cyclist
    when we say the same thing about welfare recipients, you cry like a wounded buffalo Sopchoppy
    It's their money, they spend it how they like. Truth and honesty have nothing to do with it. - Mr Jr
    "“A radical is one who advocates sweeping changes in the existing laws and methods of government.” "
  • HomerSimpsonHomerSimpson Posts: 6,573 Admiral
    Cyclist wrote: »
    TABLE 4-2
    Efficiencies of common energy conversion devices
    Energy Conversion Device Energy Conversion Typical
    Efficiency, %
    Electric heater Electricity/Thermal 100
    Hair drier Electricity/Thermal 100
    Electric generator Mechanical/Electricity 95
    Electric motor (large) Electricity/Mechanical 90
    Battery Chemical/Electricity 90
    Steam boiler (power plant) Chemical/Thermal 85
    Home gas furnace Chemical/Thermal 85
    Home oil furnace Chemical/Thermal 65
    Electric motor (small) Electricity/Mechanical 65
    Home coal furnace Chemical/Thermal 55
    Steam turbine Thermal/Mechanical 45
    Gas turbine (aircraft) Chemical/Mechanical 35
    Gas turbine (industrial) Chemical/Mechanical 30
    Automobile engine Chemical/Mechanical 25
    Fluorescent lamp Electricity/Light 20
    Silicon solar cell Solar/Electricity 15
    Steam locomotive Chemical/Mechanical 10
    Incandescent lamp Electricity/Light 5
    Heat

    you're missing the point. If the solar panel is rated for 100-watts, but has an effiency of 80%, you are only getting 80 watts of power. So when you do your calculations, you have to use 80 instead of 100. Then you need to account for the decrease in effeincy over time.

    this has nothing to do in comparision against other things.
  • Toothy ThangToothy Thang Posts: 1,440 Officer
    buy'em, I'll come over and throw rocks at it.
  • drkpttdrkptt Posts: 1,927 Captain
    you're missing the point. If the solar panel is rated for 100-watts, but has an effiency of 80%, you are only getting 80 watts of power. So when you do your calculations, you have to use 80 instead of 100. Then you need to account for the decrease in effeincy over time.

    this has nothing to do in comparision against other things.

    You're making up a new definition of efficiency. What you are talking about is a discrepancy between rated and measured power. Also, see Tater's comment above where he has observed a system making 40% over its rated output.
  • drkpttdrkptt Posts: 1,927 Captain
    CaptTater wrote: »
    Yes it will pump back and FPL is required to buy it.

    At what rate? They could pay anywhere from wholesale to more than retail (feed-in tariff) for solar.
    Cyclist wrote: »
    I have a friend with a similar sounding system on a large modern house with all the amenities. He breaks even on electric every month. He is also not planning on leaving the house any time soon.

    I believe Gainesville is one of the few places in the country with a feed-in tariff. Looks like GRU buys PV power for up to 24 cents a kWh (more than double what they charge for electricity).

    http://www.dsireusa.org/incentives/incentive.cfm?Incentive_Code=FL77F
  • CaptTaterCaptTater Posts: 20,096 AG
    you're missing the point. If the solar panel is rated for 100-watts, but has an effiency of 80%, you are only getting 80 watts of power. So when you do your calculations, you have to use 80 instead of 100. Then you need to account for the decrease in effeincy over time.

    this has nothing to do in comparision against other things.
    a 100watt panel can produce a 100 watts, a lot more than that, up to 10x as much solar energy falls on a panel. Only 10-20% is turned into electricity. If we had 80% efficient panels we would all have them.
    I did not read the story but if you take tax payers money maybe you should be held to some standards.-Cyclist
    when we say the same thing about welfare recipients, you cry like a wounded buffalo Sopchoppy
    It's their money, they spend it how they like. Truth and honesty have nothing to do with it. - Mr Jr
    "“A radical is one who advocates sweeping changes in the existing laws and methods of government.” "
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