ACCOUNTABILITY

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Replies

  • FLDXTFLDXT Posts: 2,521 Captain
    All I know is I hope we get some more bad pictures with goofy edits, some more free advertisements for pen hunts and party boats and one more Harb life history review.
  • navigator2navigator2 Posts: 22,472 AG
    harbison said:
    From Tarponator

    Pass a law/regulation that requires you to use a phone application that you take a picture of your fish (against a measuring device?) before you put it in the cooler.  In order to possess it, you have to have registered your catch in the application, and the catches are registered in real time (when in cell range) or upon return to cell range if you're too far offshore to register it and stored in the app in the meantime.  If you don't have a phone, you log the catch the same way (except writing it down in a log book) and are required by law to send it in within one week of returning to port (or otherwise self-report).

    A possible start from NOAA:

    NOAA

    In a new report, NOAA Fisheries describes how electronic technologies, including web and app-based data collection programs, may improve the agency's estimates of marine recreational catch. The report finds "opt-in," or non-mandatory, angler reporting apps to be appropriate for collecting qualitative data that support citizen science-based studies. But for these apps to produce population-level estimates of recreational catch, a large proportion of anglers would have to consistently use them to report accurate information about their fishing trips, and a statistically valid probability-based sampling survey would have to validate self-reported data, monitor the extent of reporting, and account for unreported trips.

    Could be a possible start. However, I have questions about "opt-in," or non-mandatory aspect.

    What do you think?


    From my personal view point, I think my first technological investment in that scenario would be radar shield scrambling and drone plane ghosting software making my vessel invisible at distances greater than 30 meters. But that's just me. 


    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • kodiakzachkodiakzach Posts: 6,079 Admiral
    To me, the most fascinating thing about this post is that people still post on this forum. Still can’t believe what a once great forum has become a decade later. Sad
  • JohnnyBanditJohnnyBandit Posts: 8,305 Admiral
    To me, the most fascinating thing about this post is that people still post on this forum. Still can’t believe what a once great forum has become a decade later. Sad
    Killjoy
  • harbisonharbison Posts: 3,714 Captain
    edited October 9 #36
    "Still can’t believe what a once great forum has become a decade later. Sad"

    Sad indeed!   Ten year ago the name of the game was RESPECT! 
    Today some would rather find fault than contribute anything positive. 
    Case in point! 
    "All I know is I hope we get some more bad pictures with goofy edits, some more free advertisements for pen hunts and party boats and one more Harb life history review."

    Hopefully some on here will learn from the new generation:



  • BinderBinder Posts: 3,879 Captain
    I say kill the juvi's with a 50 cal and call it a day.
  • harbisonharbison Posts: 3,714 Captain
    "I say kill the juvi's with a 50 cal and call it a day."
    Love It ! 

  • prowlin4redsprowlin4reds Posts: 956 Officer
    What do you do with the meat, when it’s already turned to sausage?
    Survival is not mandatory.....
  • FLDXTFLDXT Posts: 2,521 Captain
    harbison said:
    "Still can’t believe what a once great forum has become a decade later. Sad"

    Sad indeed!   Ten year ago the name of the game was RESPECT! 
    Today some would rather find fault than contribute anything positive. 
    Case in point! 
    "All I know is I hope we get some more bad pictures with goofy edits, some more free advertisements for pen hunts and party boats and one more Harb life history review."

    Hopefully some on here will learn from the new generation:



    "Kills" not hunts, you apparently haven't hunted in decades, what you are doing is killing, that what happens when the desire to pull the trigger and take hero pics outweighs the desire to pursue and every ounce of being an outdoorsmen leaves the body.
    And respect goes both ways, you apparently have never learned that by your name calling of any person that disagrees with your poorly formed opinions.
  • harbisonharbison Posts: 3,714 Captain
    edited October 10 #41
    "What do you do with the meat, when it’s already turned to sausage?"

    Teach others how to enjoy it:


    "what you are doing is killing"   Most consider that to be part of hunting.
    "every ounce of being an outdoorsmen"   is still as strong as ever. 
    "name calling"    If this is "name calling"... "Today some would rather find fault than contribute anything positive." 
    Then I am guilty and proud of it!  That's about the extent of my 'name calling'. 
    "your poorly formed opinions."      Wow!  Talk about 'finding fault'! 
    My opinions, and sharing of, are based on many decades of actual in the field experiences such as...
    Hunted hogs at Avon Park WMA with dogs for years, still hunted Aucilla WMA for over a decade, Hunted Southwood Hunting Club for years, hunted Buck & Boar Hunting Club for 20 years. All were extremely successful fair-chaise hunts.
    And that's just hogs. 
    Hunted and harvested deer from one end of Florida to the other, Georgia, and Alabama. Tracked and harvested deer many times in the deep-snow high mountain ranges of extremely remote, cold, Jackman, Maine.
    Harvested elk in the tall timbers of New Mexico. 
    All of the above were completely open-range, fair-chaise, non guided, hunts. 
    Today my circumstances are completely different; I have adjusted accordingly. Adjusted and enjoying every minute of it while taking great pride in showing, teaching, others how they too can do the same. 
    Respect: I have a tremendous respect for our state, our sport, and fellow sportsmen/women.
    I have absolutely NO RESPECT for those who see only what they consider to be the BAD
                                         "  bad pictures with goofy edits "
    while ignoring the good. 

    "Hopefully some on here will learn from the new (as well as the older) generation"
  • TarponatorTarponator Under a BridgePosts: 12,962 AG
    edited October 13 #42
    harbison said:
    From Tarponator

    Pass a law/regulation that requires you to use a phone application that you take a picture of your fish (against a measuring device?) before you put it in the cooler.  In order to possess it, you have to have registered your catch in the application, and the catches are registered in real time (when in cell range) or upon return to cell range if you're too far offshore to register it and stored in the app in the meantime.  If you don't have a phone, you log the catch the same way (except writing it down in a log book) and are required by law to send it in within one week of returning to port (or otherwise self-report).

    A possible start from NOAA:

    NOAA

    In a new report, NOAA Fisheries describes how electronic technologies, including web and app-based data collection programs, may improve the agency's estimates of marine recreational catch. The report finds "opt-in," or non-mandatory, angler reporting apps to be appropriate for collecting qualitative data that support citizen science-based studies. But for these apps to produce population-level estimates of recreational catch, a large proportion of anglers would have to consistently use them to report accurate information about their fishing trips, and a statistically valid probability-based sampling survey would have to validate self-reported data, monitor the extent of reporting, and account for unreported trips.

    Could be a possible start. However, I have questions about "opt-in," or non-mandatory aspect.

    What do you think?

    I like the idea, and voluntary reporting is probably a good first step....but I don't see enough people complying in order to make the results statically valid.

    So if voluntary doesn't work, I think that it should be mandatory and required by law.
  • harbisonharbison Posts: 3,714 Captain
    "I like the idea, and voluntary reporting is probably a good first step....but I don't see enough people complying in order to make the results statically valid."

    "So if voluntary doesn't work, I think that it should be mandatory and required by law."

    Strongly agree!   
  • Tom HiltonTom Hilton Posts: 1,585 Captain
    Voluntary reporting is useless.
  • Mackeral SnatcherMackeral Snatcher Posts: 10,999 AG
    And Roy and the boys would NEVER rely on that sort of data.
    THERE SHOULD BE NO COMMERCIAL FISHING ALLOWED FOR ANY SPECIES THAT IS CONSIDERED OVERFISHED.
  • harbisonharbison Posts: 3,714 Captain
    "Voluntary reporting is useless."   Unfortunate but so very true! 

    "And Roy and the boys would NEVER rely on that sort of data"      Feel sure they would manipulate the data to 'prove' whatever it is they so desire to prove.
  • spanglerspangler daBurgPosts: 1,692 Captain
    edited October 15 #47
    Personally, I'm not a fan of mandatory reporting for recreational fishing.  We're slowly taking the fun out it.  It's micromanagement.  Bag limits, slots and seasons have been working and getting dialed in for over a hundred years now.  Has brought resources back from the dead, and case after case of how they've allowed countless species to thrive.  We've gotten really good at it if you ask me.  Maybe there's good years and bad years as you adjust for all kinds of influences.  But you're gonna get those no matter what you do.  No matter how much data you collect.  That's life!  Life isn't predictable.  Let's not make life an ever increasing burden as well..
  • bicyclistbicyclist FlardaPosts: 959 Officer
    For those interested in the Gulf, it's fishery and history of commercial and sport fishing this book is a great and enjoyable read. Jack is a buddy of mine and the book is fantastic.He is a great writer.

    ARS were here, they just were not targeted by the first yankee commercial fisherman, they didn't know any better.

    Jack goes into depth about the history of the fisheries and the Natural history of the fisheries.

    Great book!


    https://www.pulitzer.org/winners/jack-e-davis

    The Gulf: The Making of an American Sea, by Jack E. Davis (Liveright/W.W. Norton)

    An important environmental history of the Gulf of Mexico that brings crucial attention to Earth’s 10th-largest body of water, one of the planet’s most diverse and productive marine ecosystems.


    Jack E. Davis is the author of the award-winning "An Everglades Providence: Marjory Stoneman Douglas and the American Environmental Century." A professor of environmental history at the University of Florida, he grew up on the Gulf coast, and now lives in Florida and New Hampshire.


    Reviewed by:

    • Christopher Morris
    The Gulf: The Making of an American Sea. By Jack E. Davis. (New York: Live-right Publishing Corp., 2017. Pp. 592. Illustrations, notes, index.)

    Environmental historian Jack Davis follows what he calls painter Winslow Homer’s truth, the “intimate and vital connection linking human-kind, nature, and history” (5), through five centuries and five hundred-plus pages of history in the Gulf of Mexico. Homer was attracted to the Gulf by its scenic beauty and rich wildlife, and so have been millions of others from the distant past to the present. Estuaries—the world’s most productive ecosystems—attracted Native people to the Gulf shores. After 1500 a host of Europeans followed, this time coming by sea, and tried to bring the area under the control of various empires. People continue to be attracted to where the land meets the sea. The beaches around the Gulf’s perimeter, from Key West to Campeche Bay, Mexico, bordered by turquoise water, have attracted hordes of people. So too have the fish, shellfish, and oil that lies below. That oil threatens to tar the entire region, making for perhaps the most visible of a host of environmental problems facing the present-day Gulf.

    So richly productive of harvestable marine life were the estuaries that the fish and shellfish of southwest Florida provided sustenance for one of the world’s rare examples of a complex, sedentary culture not based on agriculture. It was not the estuaries, however, that attracted the Spanish, but the twenty-thousand people who lived in their midst, many upon mounds made of shells. The Spaniards failed to replicate the success of the indigenous inhabitants in taking advantage of the estuaries in part because the diseases they brought with them from Europe decimated Native populations. But the Spaniards’ descendants adapted well enough to establish the first Euro-American fishing villages along the Florida and Louisiana coasts. Fishermen from New England later pioneered the offshore industry that remains so vital today. Toward the end of the nineteenth century, the railroads that took fish away from the canneries of Biloxi and Pensacola brought midwestern vacationers to the coast, but disease, malaria and yellow fever in particular, delayed beach cottage and hotel development until the early twentieth century, when disease declined and industry and leisure flourished. Fish and shellfish brought sportsmen along with jobs and factories. [End Page 105]

    Davis asserts that this “industrial takeover of the region” (283) made the Gulf of Mexico into an American sea, even though Mexico and Cuba border the southern half of the coast and have legal claim to territorial waters, fish, and other offshore resources. Nevertheless, the Gulf, Davis argues, effectively belongs to the nation that has exploited it most thoroughly. The United States catches most of the fish, lines more beaches with resorts, directs more shipping through busier ports, and withdraws more oil than any other country on the Gulf.

    Natural processes similar to those that maintain the estuaries produced the algae, zooplankton, and sand that, over millions of years, produced the oil beneath the Gulf floor. If America’s conquest of the Gulf began in the nineteenth century, with the rise of its commercial fishing industry, it was cinched with the growth of its oil extraction and refineries. Davis’s chapters on drilling on and off the Texas and Louisiana coasts are full of characters such as John Gaillard, the rancher who opened “the grandest estuary in Texas, the Trinity-San Jacinto” (274) for oil extraction. For the most part, the “messy business of taking oil from the earth” (263) has not yet interfered with fishing and tourism. Contamination, even when acute, such as at Texas’s Goose Creek estuary, near Galveston, is typically isolated. Offshore spills, such as at Campeche Bay in 1979 and at the Deepwater Horizon site in 2010, inflict broader damage, fatal to marine life but not to the Gulf economy. Rather, coastal erosion and estuary degradation, to which the oil industry, in particular, has contributed, threaten the human livelihood of the Gulf.





  • bicyclistbicyclist FlardaPosts: 959 Officer
    edited October 15 #49
    YOU CAN LISTEN to an interview here. Really good.

    This week on Florida Matters, we talk about how the environmental history of the Gulf of Mexico shaped human life over the years with Jack E. Davis, whose book The Gulf: The Making of An American Sea won the 2018 Pulitzer Prize for History.

    Davis is a professor of history and sustainability studies at the University of Florida. His book received a number of other accolades, including the Kirkus Prize and a New York Times Notable Book.

    Davis talks about his personal connections to the Gulf and how the sea and communities surrounding it have evolved since his childhood.

    We talk with Davis about how the sport of tarpon fishing in the Gulf kick-started Florida’s tourism industry, and the important roles other marine species like oysters, sponges and mullet played in Gulf communities.

    We also talk about some notable people who had connections to the Gulf, like painter Winslow Homer and baseball player Ted Williams.





    This site has sections to preview.


  • Tom HiltonTom Hilton Posts: 1,585 Captain
    Agreed - bag limits and season days have proven over the years to work fine - all this “accountability” BS is just a ruse to justify Catch Shares.  Just look at the trout/redfish fisheries where an exponentially larger number of people are fishing 365 days/year in a small fraction of the area - the proof is in the pudding.  
  • pottydocpottydoc The thriving metropolis of Umatilla Posts: 3,494 Captain
    harbison said:
    "What do you do with the meat, when it’s already turned to sausage?"

    Teach others how to enjoy it:


    "what you are doing is killing"   Most consider that to be part of hunting.
    "every ounce of being an outdoorsmen"   is still as strong as ever. 
    "name calling"    If this is "name calling"... "Today some would rather find fault than contribute anything positive." 
    Then I am guilty and proud of it!  That's about the extent of my 'name calling'. 
    "your poorly formed opinions."      Wow!  Talk about 'finding fault'! 
    My opinions, and sharing of, are based on many decades of actual in the field experiences such as...
    Hunted hogs at Avon Park WMA with dogs for years, still hunted Aucilla WMA for over a decade, Hunted Southwood Hunting Club for years, hunted Buck & Boar Hunting Club for 20 years. All were extremely successful fair-chaise hunts.
    And that's just hogs. 
    Hunted and harvested deer from one end of Florida to the other, Georgia, and Alabama. Tracked and harvested deer many times in the deep-snow high mountain ranges of extremely remote, cold, Jackman, Maine.
    Harvested elk in the tall timbers of New Mexico. 
    All of the above were completely open-range, fair-chaise, non guided, hunts. 
    Today my circumstances are completely different; I have adjusted accordingly. Adjusted and enjoying every minute of it while taking great pride in showing, teaching, others how they too can do the same. 
    Respect: I have a tremendous respect for our state, our sport, and fellow sportsmen/women.
    I have absolutely NO RESPECT for those who see only what they consider to be the BAD
                                         "  bad pictures with goofy edits "
    while ignoring the good. 

    "Hopefully some on here will learn from the new (as well as the older) generation"
    Hunters don’t “harvest” anything. We kill it. Farmers harvest things. We need to call it what it is, and stay away from pc bull. 
  • harbisonharbison Posts: 3,714 Captain

     "We need to call it what it is"   Wish whoever "we" is would learn to...

    And leave the semantics to those who know what they are talking about.  
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