Why American policing is off the rails and is the problem.

tankard

cpr said:

Don't resist, in every video the cops are always yelled stop resisting.
Don't give the cops lip. Smile and be polite. The beach ho in NJ refused to pore her booze out and mouthed off. She then resisted and got  a well deserved punch.

LMFAO. Are you this stupid?

They yell "STOP RESISTING" to cover their a s s e s.....as they beat yours....

kellercl

Not that it would ever happen, but all those high crime pockets that complain about cops daily...  I would love to see the police force just quit doing their job for a month, and see how quickly those complainers beg for their return.

Gardawg

kellercl said:

Not that it would ever happen, but all those high crime pockets that complain about cops daily...  I would love to see the police force just quit doing their job for a month, and see how quickly those complainers beg for their return.

paraphrase:
 "Hey those other guys would be rougher on you. At least we spit on it first." 

kellercl

Gardawg said:

kellercl said:

Not that it would ever happen, but all those high crime pockets that complain about cops daily...  I would love to see the police force just quit doing their job for a month, and see how quickly those complainers beg for their return.

paraphrase:
 "Hey those other guys would be rougher on you. At least we spit on it first." 

More like the grass is always greener, be careful what you ask for, dont know what you have till its gone, etc.... something about rocks and glass house.

surfman

That used to be the standard complaint in those areas, they claimed it was so bad because the cops avoided the area, the cops are in a no win situation.

Cyclist

Those areas need more than cops. They have neglected infrastructure, no jobs, poor schools (money goes to schools in rich areas), etc. You name it. And these problems started many many years ago with government redlining, jim crow, etc.

You can't fix 200 hundred years of oppression in 20 years (or even 50 years), with no money.

stc1993

Cyclist said:

A black driver is about 31 percent more likely to be pulled over than a white driver, or about 23 percent more likely than a Hispanic driver. "Driving while black" is, indeed, a measurable phenomenon.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2014/09/09/you-really-can-get-pulled-over-for-driving-while-black-federal-statistics-show/?utm_term=.a61dc9791931

Do you watch the show live PD?  Watch it for a while & you'll see why.

surfman

Yea, that's right all they need is money, more money, money fixes everything.

TerminatorX

Come and take it Globalists.  Please.

TerminatorX

Cyclist has white privelage

Cyclist

TerminatorX said:

Cyclist has white privelage

Most assuredly, I was born a white male in America. More privileged than 99.9 percent of humans that ever lived....and my family was just middle class.

surfman

Quit flaunting it.

Madbeach

Dad was a watch commander throught he 70's, 80's, and 90's. He became tired of the bs politics.  Long are the days where a good ole fashion criminology degree pushed you up the ranks over those with military experience (a combo of both was preferable).  In my opinion, we've seen a change in how govm't works.  Seems that it has become a revenue stream.  LEO's are being trained to workship the establishment, not our constitutional rights.       

cadman

Cyclist said:

cadman said:

Cyclist said:

There’s no training on how to de-escalate tense scenarios in which no crime has been committed, even though the majority of police calls fall into that category.

Let us pretend for a minute, 

Scenario one:

You are a police officer, You got a call that a violent crime has happened. You encounter a person who you think might be the suspect, Unknown to you, he is not the person you seek, 

You approach the individual who is confrontational and belligerent. He just had a fight with his wife and is in a really bad mood, but again, you do not know this. 

You ask the person to halt and ask to see his I.D. He tells you to f off, you are just harassing him for no reason. He takes a few steps in your direction, Your backup has just arrived behind you and about to get out of his car. The person, who you believe fits the description of a violent criminal, is coming at you, yelling and screaming and making threats. 

What do you do to de-escalate this situation? 

Scenario two:

Just as above, except the guy is a violent criminal who is trying  to get to you and your gun to kill you and the other cops,

How do you de-escalate this situation?


How do you determine which is which?

Before you answer any of those questions, which I doubt you do, let me say for a fact, if i was a police officer, I would not want you for a partner. I would like to end my day alive. 

That quote is from an Afghanistan soldier and CIA operative and now Savanna police officer. I think he probably knows more about this than you do...

What does that have to do with answering my questions IK posed to you. 

I think you took  more from the article than the author intended. 

TerminatorX

tankard said:

cpr said:

Don't resist, in every video the cops are always yelled stop resisting.
Don't give the cops lip. Smile and be polite. The beach ho in NJ refused to pore her booze out and mouthed off. She then resisted and got  a well deserved punch.

LMFAO. Are you this stupid?

They yell "STOP RESISTING" to cover their a s s e s.....as they beat yours....

No they don’t.  There is no police problem.  Look at the statistics.  There’s a black on blacks and everyone else problem.  Fact

cadman

Cyclist, you copy and paste the sections of the article you like and overlook the other parts.

“A huge amount of what police actually do is support and service and problem-solving,” David M. Kennedy told me. “And part of what’s so inside out is that most of that activity is not recognized.” Police officers are increasingly filling the gaps of a broken state. “They do it essentially on their own, usually without adequate training and preparation, often without the skills they need, and overwhelmingly without the resources and institutional connections that it would take to do those things well.”

TerminatorX

Yep.  Cyclist is just your average ****.  He gets triggered by an American flag or a military uniform.  He’s perfectly happy with the hammer and sickle.

cadman

Cyclist said:

I am assuming that not many read the article. That is what we are discussing. If you can't read the article then why are you here discussing the article?

I posted the opinion of a person who has policed everyone from bin laden to Savanna misfits. He has a good take on the situation and his experiences in Afghanistan and Savanna are incredibly interesting.

I am basing my opinion in part on his testimony in this article.

One thing Sullivan says that sticks in my mind is that we are spending billions and billions oversees with lots of money paying off informants and getting hosed by informants with bad info. All for little benefit to Americans. Then the Savanna police force, which has a hell of a lot more to do with the safety of Americans than does some perpetual semi-war in the middle east is getting hosed with no money for training and proper equipment. Thay can get armored vehicles and grenade launchers buy money for tasers is not to be had.

Crazy. Sullivan is a true American hero.

I read the article a lot better than you did, but I didn't read ti with a bias against cops already in my mind like you have, 

That is not testimony, that is the reporter's interpretation of what Sullivan told him. Only the items in quotes are Sullivan's words. The rest are what the reporter wanted you to believe he said. I noticed the reporter had a habit of quoting one comment and expanding his opinion into what Sullivan told him.

You need to learn that reporters have a habit of interjecting their opinions into articles wherever they can. 

Also, government programs allow excess equipment to be given to local governments at little or no cost. There is little cost to acquire a lot of government surplus property. 

Tasers users must be certified in their use before issue and re-certified annually. Tasers can not be just handed out to every officer. Your reporter either neglected to report this or is poorly informed. 

Cyclist

cadman said:

Cyclist said:

I am assuming that not many read the article. That is what we are discussing. If you can't read the article then why are you here discussing the article?

I posted the opinion of a person who has policed everyone from bin laden to Savanna misfits. He has a good take on the situation and his experiences in Afghanistan and Savanna are incredibly interesting.

I am basing my opinion in part on his testimony in this article.

One thing Sullivan says that sticks in my mind is that we are spending billions and billions oversees with lots of money paying off informants and getting hosed by informants with bad info. All for little benefit to Americans. Then the Savanna police force, which has a hell of a lot more to do with the safety of Americans than does some perpetual semi-war in the middle east is getting hosed with no money for training and proper equipment. Thay can get armored vehicles and grenade launchers buy money for tasers is not to be had.

Crazy. Sullivan is a true American hero.

I read the article a lot better than you did, but I didn't read ti with a bias against cops already in my mind like you have, 

That is not testimony, that is the reporter's interpretation of what Sullivan told him. Only the items in quotes are Sullivan's words. The rest are what the reporter wanted you to believe he said. I noticed the reporter had a habit of quoting one comment and expanding his opinion into what Sullivan told him.

You need to learn that reporters have a habit of interjecting their opinions into articles wherever they can. 

Also, government programs allow excess equipment to be given to local governments at little or no cost. There is little cost to acquire a lot of government surplus property. 

Tasers users must be certified in their use before issue and re-certified annually. Tasers can not be just handed out to every officer. Your reporter either neglected to report this or is poorly informed. 

Sullivan said everyone was handed a gun, but no money for tasers. It was his comment, and his comment on the military hardware. He didn't say they spent billions on military hardware, he just questioned the need for cops to actually have billions of dollars of military gear. The police are becoming militarized. That is one point that Sullivan made over and over again.

I think you read the article with bias and blame it on the reporter - that your bias did not match Sullivans. You miss the parts where Sullivan is the only cop to respond to most calls with his gun in his holster....says volumes about what he actually thinks HIS mission and the mission the police actually is. I think you are misrepresenting the entire point of why Sullivan became a cop and quit the military. Explains the note he pinned on his camos when he went on tactical missions in Afghanistan very well.

cadman

Cyclist said.

I read the article a lot better than you did, but I didn't read ti with a bias against cops already in my mind like you have, 

That is not testimony, that is the reporter's interpretation of what Sullivan told him. Only the items in quotes are Sullivan's words. The rest are what the reporter wanted you to believe he said. I noticed the reporter had a habit of quoting one comment and expanding his opinion into what Sullivan told him.

You need to learn that reporters have a habit of interjecting their opinions into articles wherever they can. 

Also, government programs allow excess equipment to be given to local governments at little or no cost. There is little cost to acquire a lot of government surplus property. 

Tasers users must be certified in their use before issue and re-certified annually. Tasers can not be just handed out to every officer. Your reporter either neglected to report this or is poorly informed.\

Sullivan said everyone was handed a gun, but no money for tasers. It was his comment, and his comment on the military hardware. He didn't say they spent billions on military hardware, he just questioned the need for cops to actually have billions of dollars of military gear. The police are becoming militarized. That is one point that Sullivan made over and over again.

I think you read the article with bias and blame it on the reporter - that your bias did not match Sullivans. You miss the parts where Sullivan is the only cop to respond to most calls with his gun in his holster....says volumes about what he actually thinks HIS mission and the mission the police actually is. I think you are misrepresenting the entire point of why Sullivan became a cop and quit the military. Explains the note he pinned on his camos when he went on tactical missions in Afghanistan very well. 

Thank you for proving my point about your bias and also proving who read the article better. 

Sullivan did not say "everyone was handed a gun, but no money for tasers. It was his comment, and his comment on the military hardware". The reporter said that. There was no quotes around the statement. The reporter used quotes for any comment made by Sullivan. it was the reporters opinion on why the officers weren't issued tasers. 

Here is the paragraph. Please show me quotes where Sullivan said what you claimed. 

According to David M. Kennedy, one of the nation’s leading criminologists, American policing is practiced more as a craft than as a profession. “The kind of thinking that should go into framing and refining what a profession of public safety should be has still not been done,” he told me. Officers are deployed as enforcers of the state, without being taught psychology, anthropology, sociology, community dynamics, local history, or criminology. Lethal force is prioritized above other options. When Skinner joined the police force, everyone in his class was given a pistol, but none were given Tasers, because the department had run out.

TerminatorX

Cyclist said:

TerminatorX said:

Cyclist has white privelage

Most assuredly, I was born a white male in America. More privileged than 99.9 percent of humans that ever lived....and my family was just middle class.

This dude is so ashamed of his color.  MLK would feel very sad for you pal.  Grow up and act like a man.  Go work a food bank and quit preaching to us while you vote for globalist pedophiles and baby killers.  How’s that for reality?

Jack Hexter

Cyclist said:

Jack Hexter said:

Cyclist  Please answer cad's questions in post 40 of this thread, then go on to answer Westwall01's question above as it relates to your answer to Cadman's scenarios

Read the article...

Okay, I read the entire article.  Now please answer the question from your prospective, not from the prospective of a single police officer in Savannah.  How do you perceive Skinner's actions given the two scenarios put forth by Cad.  Then answer how you would train officers to react to these two scenarios.

onthefifty

.

mustang190

Cyclist said:

Those areas need more than cops. They have neglected infrastructure, no jobs, poor schools (money goes to schools in rich areas), etc. You name it. And these problems started many many years ago with government redlining, jim crow, etc.

You can't fix 200 hundred years of oppression in 20 years (or even 50 years), with no money.

Those problems started in the 1960’s with the democrats great society. 
Get your facts straight.  

cadman

Jack Hexter said:

Okay, I read the entire article.  Now please answer the question from your prospective, not from the prospective of a single police officer in Savannah.  How do you perceive Skinner's actions given the two scenarios put forth by Cad.  Then answer how you would train officers to react to these two scenarios.

We will never get an answer. Cyclist hates cops for some reason and won't say why or explain anything. he misreads articles and turns them into something they don't say to fit his personal agenda. 
Sullivan even says in the article that many cops do what he does, they aren't out to shoot everyone or escalate the situation. His only concern is how they are trained and how must of it they pick up on the job through experience. 

The reporter tries to slant it towards the weapons and vehicles on his own and cyclist tries to amplify that portion of the article to fit his bias. 

surfman

Reporters inject their opinions??? Wait a minute........

Gardawg

mustang190 said:

Those problems started in the 1960’s with the democrats great society. 
Get your facts straight.  

That would depend upon your definition of problems.

If equality before the law is a problem for you then the civil rights legislation of the 1960s' is a defining moment. Then again if the lack of equality before the law is a problem for you then your problems started earlier.





Our racial problems are the legacy of slavery.

Exodus 34:7 English Standard Version (ESV)

7 keeping steadfast love for thousands,[a] forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, but who will by no means clear the guilty, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children and the children's children, to the third and the fourth generation.”

cpr

tankard said:

cpr said:

Don't resist, in every video the cops are always yelled stop resisting.
Don't give the cops lip. Smile and be polite. The beach ho in NJ refused to pore her booze out and mouthed off. She then resisted and got  a well deserved punch.

LMFAO. Are you this stupid?

They yell "STOP RESISTING" to cover their a s s e s.....as they beat yours....

Of course they do, they know someone with a phone is recording. BTW that cop was wrong to punch her. If he had used his baton he have been okay. That is considered a policing tool, fist are not.

cpr

more stats one race and crime for anyone interested 

https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/crime-in-the-u.s.-2011/tables/table-43'

Finfinder

Cyclist said:

Those areas need more than cops. They have neglected infrastructure, no jobs, poor schools (money goes to schools in rich areas), etc. You name it. And these problems started many many years ago with government redlining, jim crow, etc.

You can't fix 200 hundred years of oppression in 20 years (or even 50 years), with no money.

You just made the case for one brand's of politics abject failure.  The management of these areas needs a big change,   Pull the stopper and drain it.