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I would not describe the HAB event as pathogenic. It's a more of a change in water chemistry that initiates it. The HAB then maintains itself with the nutrients from the wildlife killed. If there is enough source and favorable continuing environmental conditions, the cycle continues and may accelerate.
This is what happened in 2011 and is repeating now.
Once the cycle begins and reaches a point where it becomes self-sustaining it's difficult to change by modifying the input. This is similar to the conditions we are experiencing with the sea grass die off n Florida Bay. Those conditions are thought to be attributed to lack of fresh water entering the system. Most of that was identified as resulting from drought conditions local to the area.
Sea grasses have a limited range of salinity tolerance. Impacts are closely related to rainfall. That rainfall becomes stormwater. In urban areas the stormwater then carries nutrients and bacteria from urban sources and creates an environment favorable to HAB events.
Not much can be done about the weather, but the stormwater and the sources of the nutrient inflows can be regulated and mitigated with engineering solutions.
All it takes is money and the political will to raise and spend it. That money will come from you, personally in the form of increased taxation and in the case of septic tank replacement, property assessments. And a lot of it is going to be needed. That's what you are committing to when you write and call.
"Well Gary, the easiest way to look tall is to stand in a room full of short people." - Curtis Bostick
"All these forums, with barely any activity, are like a neglected old cemetery that no one visits anymore."- anonymouse
In you opinion, would another inlet or 2, say at Spessard Holland golf course and the north end of PAFB (maybe even the end of bethel creek), help or hurt the lagoon at this point. Would this 'something' be better than the nothing we continue to get? I understand the salinity level issues, just seems like an imperfect fix (re: compromise) would be better than nothing, if it at least helps some. An inlet or 2 seems more doable than reworking all of the drainage in east central Florida, removing all septic tanks (even aerobic ones?) and banning all fertilizing. Maybe the state could even mandate some sort of water exchange at port Canaveral? At that point we could begin to work on these more scientifically correct, extremely less do-able solutions (septic, drainage, fertilizers). We could even fill the inlets in over time if we get other measures in place.
I hear the FDEP and ACOE are cutting inlet permits left and right...
And it is about dang time too!! Even though probably 20 years too late. We've destroyed the goose that lays the golden eggs.......turning what draws everyone here into a cess pool. I've said it before "real" Florida never stood a chance against "Disney" Florida.
I would like to say that I know, but I don't know. I do know that I can apply lessons learned from other geographies in South Florida. Those lessons center on not mitigating the symptoms, but eliminating the cause. That surgery is going to be costly and painful to you, the patient. Since there is no insurance for this affliction, you will need to pay a high premium to resolve it. That will not be satisfied by letter writing campaign and noise, bit direct participation by individual action and purse.
That involves regulating residential and agricultural fertilizer use and conversion of individual residential septic tank systems to centralized advanced wastewater treatment facilities.
That is something you can do directly and does not require the gnashing of teeth, ripping of clothes,saturation of social media, and lamenting to the Lord's heavens.
"Well Gary, the easiest way to look tall is to stand in a room full of short people." - Curtis Bostick
"All these forums, with barely any activity, are like a neglected old cemetery that no one visits anymore."- anonymouse
I agree with Gary in that....I don't know.
What I do think is it will detract from what THE REAL FIX IS.....It will take time( lots of time to do modeling, secure permitting, get bids yada yada yada) money.. BOATLOADS of it!
And this for what?...a questionable partial fix?
How about the "unintended consequences".... You can bet their would be "unforeseen issues" that will crop up.
It is a bitter pill.....and I'm sorry I cannot sugar coat it....but that would be disingenuous.
Many things to do.
Knots to be unraveled
'fore the darkness falls on you
If anything was going to be done without requiring "the gnashing of teeth, ripping of clothes, saturation of social media, and lamenting to the Lord's heavens" then it would have been already. The issues have been no secret for at least 2 decades now but build, build, build, and build some more still continues..................while relatively small appropriations for conservation efforts are line item vetoed.
That is all we have gotten to this point. Nothing.
Anyone know if Aerobic septics are a reasonable alternative to sewage treatment? I wonder what percentage they reduce the nutrients percolating towards the river? You could also target the worst offenders instead of everyone... Just thoughts...
Something along these lines (throw some **** ideas at the wall and see what sticks), if studied and determined to be effective enough, would seem more realistic and more implementable than the ideal solution, which I believe is sadly unattainable.
You: " Do you think we could just try a Z pack ....maybe some Advil too? ... It will be cheaper...and you cannot say it won't help"
Many things to do.
Knots to be unraveled
'fore the darkness falls on you
I can't sit back and do nothing, even if the results equal nothing..
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March 29th 9:99-12:00
Indian River County Commission Chambers
1801 27th Street
Vero Beach, Florida 32960
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Online registration at www.ircgov.com then follow the link on the home page.
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For those who cannot attend you may watch the program live and reply on our local government channel or streaming live at www.ircgov.com
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There will be two speakers that will present potential solutions for the IRL. A ocean to lagoon pumping station that has been operational in Destin Harbor that has proved to dramatically improve water quality. Also we will have a presentation on a water scrubbing technology that again is a proved success story. These and more speakers will present recent and potential solutions to help improve the water quality in the IRL.
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Indian River Lagoon Workshop
“Are we making any progress?”
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Agenda
8:30-9:00******** Registration
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9:00-9:05 ******* Welcome, Invocation, Pledge Tim Zorc
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9:05-9:15******** 2016 Legislative update Representative Debbie Mayfield
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9:15-9:40******** Indian River Lagoon Council
Indian River Lagoon National Estuary Program
*********************** Dr. Duane De Freese, Ph.D.
*********************** Sebastian, Florida*
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9:40-10:00****** Fertilizer Enforcement / Storm Water Education
*********************** Alexis Peralta
Indian River County Public Works
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10:00-10:25**** Ground Water movement and Septic Tanks
*********************** Osprey South Relief Canal Algae Turf Scrubber
*********************** Vincent Burke PE
*********************** Indian River County Utilities Director
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10:25-10:30**** Break
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10:30-10:50**** Septic to Sewer and ways to get there.
Carter Taylor
Indian River Neighborhood Association
Vero Beach, Florida
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10:50-11:15**** Seagrass and Water Quality
*********************** Dr. Charles Jacoby Environmental Scientist
St Johns River Water Management District
Palatka, Florida
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11:15-11:40**** Nutrient remediation water technology. “Water Scrubbing”
Bill Eggers Scientist
AquaFiber®™ Winter Park, Florida
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11:40-12:10**** Bethel Creek, Indian River Lagoon & Destin Harbor, what do they have in common?
*********************** Destin Harbor Pump Station
*********************** David Bazylak City of Destin, Florida
Where do we go from here? and Q&A
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Sincerely
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Tim Zorc
Board of County Commissioners
District 3
1801 27th Street – Building A
Vero Beach, Florida 32960
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[email protected]
772-226-1492
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Per . Duane De Freese
The IRL has had a continuous green algae bloom for some time at various locations. More recently the brown algae bloom we currently see manifested several months ago. This new brown algae is in fact, new to the IRL. Its outer membrane is resistant to what we would call normal degradation. In fact, it is thriving in low temperature and low oxygen levels. To add insult to injury, the brown algae is also causing a decrease in oxygen levels. Hence, the fish kill we witnessed the last several days. We have yet to receive the toxicology reports on the dead fish, but it is pretty clear to everyone that they died due to hypoxemia (lack of oxygen).
At this point, we can’t stop the bloom. In fact, we can’t stop any bloom, once it has started on the scale of the IRL. I know that everyone is looking for a quick solution. Sadly, the solution for this episode is to let it run its course.
That’s where we are, now I will attempt to answer the question of how we got here. I’m not going to start pointing fingers at every civic leader that didn’t do enough or every resident that put grass clipping in the storm drain. That negative rhetoric doesn’t solve the problem. The cause of the degradation of our lagoon is excessive nutrient load and weather.
Excessive nutrient loading is an increase in the levels of nitrogen, phosphorus and sulfur. Although these elements occur naturally, excessive amounts cause contamination. The causes of this contamination is due to several factors.
Nutrient Loading
o Septic Tanks: There is estimated to be close to 300,000 septic tanks in the IRL district. That is not a misprint. Three Hundred Thousand!!! Along with a high water table and deterioration of the tanks themselves, massive amounts of human waste finds its way into the lagoon. This issue isn’t new. It needs to be addressed and fixed!!
o Yard Waste: Grass clippings and palm fronds are commonly tossed to the curb or thrown over a seawall. Over time this waste settles to the bottom of a canal as muck waiting to release its unwanted nutrients.
o Fertilizer/Pesticides: Inherently, Nitrogen, Phosphorus and Sulfur added to lawns and vegetation, can run off due to rain or intended watering.
Weather
o Weather is certainly a mitigating factor concerning the lagoon. Cooler temperatures generally slow down algae bloom growth, while higher temperatures accelerate the bloom. As I mentioned previously, the current bloom survived the cold season, perhaps due to the unusually high temperatures and complexity of its cellular structure.
It appears that this bloom was a perfect storm in waiting. The higher than average temperatures over the winter. The nutrient loading from septic tank outflow. The increased duration of the cyclical green algae blooms and the excessive amount of muck lying on the bottom of the IRL.
TL;DR,
Unseasonal rainfall added additional nutrients from storm water and septic systems (300,000) and fed an HAB that dropped the DO to almost none.
"Well Gary, the easiest way to look tall is to stand in a room full of short people." - Curtis Bostick
"All these forums, with barely any activity, are like a neglected old cemetery that no one visits anymore."- anonymouse
You should ask the IR county commissioners " Why is I.R. county not a member of the IR lagoon council ? ....Is it indeed fact that the city of Sebastian ponied up the money to get Indian river county a seat on and a voice on how any money for projects will be used " ....That's a good one!
If they don't bums rush you out of the meeting after that one...hit them with " Is it true, that it took three attempts to get a partial year fertilizer ban in effect...even though it would not cost the county one red cent...just to pass a rule? "
You will have fun....
Many things to do.
Knots to be unraveled
'fore the darkness falls on you
"Well Gary, the easiest way to look tall is to stand in a room full of short people." - Curtis Bostick
"All these forums, with barely any activity, are like a neglected old cemetery that no one visits anymore."- anonymouse
You should come over for this Gary....I'll buy you lunch....I'm sure I can get kicked out before noon....:rotflmao
Many things to do.
Knots to be unraveled
'fore the darkness falls on you
Theres a website a friend told me about, it has lots of news information about legislative efforts regarding the various waterways within our state. They also have a facebook page which seems to have almost no views... yet it gets updated constantly. Its worth a look, and a share.
Ill make some calls tomorrow to our elected incompetents. I dont know if it'll help, but it wont hurt... so its worth a few phone calls.
I'm going to have to take the day off from work - are we allowed to use powerpoint!!!!
quality of most of the state estuaries due to overpopulation and poor environmental controls would make
a good story for people all over to see what happens when you do not plan accordingly and ignore mother nature's warnings.
It can include Apalachicola, Indian River Lagoon, Lake Apopka, St Lucie Estuary, Florida Bay, etc.
Very soon inshore fishing, kayaking, paddle boarding, swimming will be limited to close proximity to inlets.
( on a personal note I think that the billions of dollars used to build a non profitable train from Miami to Orlando could
Have been used to enhance the quality of our lagoon)
You: " Do you think we could just try a Z pack ....maybe some Advil too? ... It will be cheaper...and you cannot say it won't help"
That's apples to oranges. You actually could have both of those. answer honestly.
Would you rather have nothing or something?
Like the stones said - you can't always get what you want.
As Gary and duck and many others have already stated our money hungry corrupt govt. officials care only about "What'$ in it for me".
The Port authority has already shown they have zero regard for the north end of our lagoon or any other part of it for that matter. Certainly can't look to them and their DEEEEEEEEEEP pocket$$$ to help clean up any of this even though tourism will be affected in the long run and all they think about is more and bigger ships in the port.
I wonder how much sewage they pump into the port under the guise of darkness only to have it ultimately go through the locks into the lagoon or nearby beach waters.
Well, If you read the peer reviewed science...it is possible that it would actually hurt...more than help.
So, the honest answer is if you are going to do something that has little if any perceived benefit...with the REAL possibility of doing *more damage*...I say do nothing...and push for REAL fixes.
Many things to do.
Knots to be unraveled
'fore the darkness falls on you