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2nd phase gator applications

ProFISHentProFISHent Posts: 731 Officer
not surprisingly, FWCs website was overloaded this morning as it has been since the beginning of swamp people, and even a year or two prior. The number of applicants this year was by far more than ever.

Even those who were awarded permits, got the infamous "error" message, but just like with everything else in life, persistence pays!

SO.......I am interested to know, WHERE everyone got tags for in the second phase applications.

I myself got 1st phase jesup, my brother got first phase harney
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Replies

  • mikefm58mikefm58 Posts: 265 Deckhand
    Here's my experience this morning.

    I'm signed in right at 9:55, looking under "Purchase License" for the link to get the permit. I start clicking on refresh at 10:00, nothing, the web site is hosed, finally comes back 3-5 minutes later with some 500 error. I click refresh again hoping to get through.

    After about 15 minutes of this, I bring up a different web browser, Mozilla Firefox, and try to sign in but I never get past "customer lookup".

    After about another 10-15 minutes of more waiting, I close all my browsers, and bring up Firefox and sign in again. Finally I get signed in. I click on Purchase License and still don't see the link to get gator tags. So I go to limited/entry and low and behold there it is, silly me. Why would I think it's under purchase license?

    By now there's slim pickings, all the lakes and rivers I wanted are sold out, so I get an Osceola county permit. And all the while I'm doing this, I'm on hold at FWC's 888 number, which I never did get through, it just went dead, no music, no hang up, nothing.

    I won't go through this grief and headache again. Next year if I'm unsuccessful in phase I, which will make it the 3rd year in a row, I'll sell my boat and all hunting equipment.

    In all of my 30 years of working in the computer industry, I have never seen a more poorly written and application process and website. Nothing is intuitively obvious, and if you click something wrong, by the time you find out, it's too late.

    FWC should be ashamed with how they've implemented Phase I & II. Thanks for listening.
  • century7century7 Posts: 2,410 Captain
    The system is crap, if there were other choices they would be out of businesses but they know there is nowhere else we can go so we are stuck with this useless system.
    It works 60% of the time all the time......
  • huntmstrhuntmstr Posts: 6,290 Admiral
    Actually there are other choices. There are 4 or 5 vendors who offer this sort of system. The problem is that they all suck. I'm begining to think it has more to do with the wide range of requirements FWC is putting on the vendor and less to do with the companies themselves. The programs should not be so difficult to write and operate. There must be something that FWC is requiring from their end that is creating the slow down or some sort of performance conflict.
    Bushnell, Primos and Final Approach Pro Staff. Proud member of the Fab Five, Big Leaugers and Bobble Head 4.

    I had you pissed off at hello.
  • onICEonICE Posts: 988 Officer
    What so you expect when you have 10,000 dudes all logging in at 959am for the "first come first served" leftovers? It sucks but there are plenty of bigger sites that couldn't handle all that traffic in a 5 minute Span either. Also no offense but you should have known EXACTLY where you were clicking at 10 am before 10 am. My dad and I fought through several error messages and got sta 1w and lake O south, our two first choices. I was surprised to see almost 30 permits leftover from sta 1 alone. That place is Jurassic park.
  • mikefm58mikefm58 Posts: 265 Deckhand
    onICE wrote: »
    What so you expect when you have 10,000 dudes all logging in at 959am for the "first come first served" leftovers? It sucks but there are plenty of bigger sites that couldn't handle all that traffic in a 5 minute Span either. Also no offense but you should have known EXACTLY where you were clicking at 10 am before 10 am. My dad and I fought through several error messages and got sta 1w and lake O south, our two first choices. I was surprised to see almost 30 permits leftover from sta 1 alone. That place is Jurassic park.

    Assuming this was directed at me. How would one know before hand that gator tags were under "limited/entry" rather than "purchase license"? If response was better I could have easily figured it out sooner. Clearly a lack of resources with their servers.

    Good luck with sta1w and Lake O south.
  • century7century7 Posts: 2,410 Captain
    10k people login to a site is not that many when you think of some of the traffic other sites see. I just think they do not have the bandwidth to handle it. Thousands of other sites handle it without a problem.
    It works 60% of the time all the time......
  • ProFISHentProFISHent Posts: 731 Officer
    I see both sides of it. Why pay for a much faster server for 1 day out of the year???? At the same time last year I drew a permit, payed, and it went to error and I lost it......I was pissed, but ended up killing a bunch of gators on other tags. This year I did the same thing but was awarded my tag.

    Mike anytime you are looking at gator stuff, look under limited entry/quota. 364 days a year their resources are fine, so I dont blame them. BUT if it was the same price, I cant figure out why they wouldnt find something more efficient. Personally I think gator permits should have preference points with how popular it has got. I love new hunters, but its frustrating when there is just one boat who dosnt know what the hel they are doing on a lake. That being said, I started somewhere also so I get it.

    Good luck to all who got tags, to those who didnt hopefully you can find someone to hunt with.
  • AllenRAllenR Posts: 2,702 Captain
    My wife maintains the internal website for one of the biggest companies in the country. Thousands of people on it a day, and at peak times, there are TONS of folks logging onto it all at one time. I just explained the FWC licensing system to her in an abbreviated cliffs notes version. She about fell out of her chair laughing when I told her of all the lock ups at peak times
  • onICEonICE Posts: 988 Officer
    mikefm58 wrote: »
    Assuming this was directed at me. How would one know before hand that gator tags were under "limited/entry" rather than "purchase license"? If response was better I could have easily figured it out sooner. Clearly a lack of resources with their servers.

    Good luck with sta1w and Lake O south.

    I didn't mean to sound rude. I just meant that I knew there were goin to be a million guys trying to get on this morning so I ran through the whole process a few times beforehand. Also for future reference ANYTHING that requires an "application" is under limited entry/quota. Not sure where you're located but if you are interested in going in on a permit for one of the areas I mentioned, let me know.
  • mrbillmrbill Posts: 1,194 Officer
    the worst system ever the site ticket master has 20 to 30000 plus log on to buy tickets at once never does it lock up !!!!!! the system is a joke for sure !!!!!!
  • mikefm58mikefm58 Posts: 265 Deckhand
    onICE wrote: »
    I didn't mean to sound rude. I just meant that I knew there were goin to be a million guys trying to get on this morning so I ran through the whole process a few times beforehand. Also for future reference ANYTHING that requires an "application" is under limited entry/quota. Not sure where you're located but if you are interested in going in on a permit for one of the areas I mentioned, let me know.

    Thanks for the offer, and no I didn't take your post as anything rude. I have a tendency to be short and to the point when I'm frustrated, and it's FWC I hold accountable. There must be something they can do so we can avoid this. I like the already mentioned idea of preference points, no idea why they aren't used with gator tags. Someone with multiple years in a row of being unsuccessful should go to the top of the phase I selection process.

    I'm up in Orlando so those 2 areas are a bit too far, but again thanks for the offer. Good luck to you.
  • ProFISHentProFISHent Posts: 731 Officer
    Mike I'm in Orlando, keep in touch. I have 16 gators to kill so far this year (haven't confirmed with a few other folks). There is usually room on a few nights, I am not a guide....but I did stay at a holiday inn express last night
  • kmf600kmf600 Posts: 188 Officer
    They need to require a deposite or even pay for the whole amount when you apply for the tag. If you don't win, you get your money back. This is crap, when 75 tags are awarded in Lake O and only half the people pay for them. If you win and don't pay, you shouldn't be allowed to apply next year, something, I don't know.
  • pbsnookerpbsnooker Posts: 882 Officer
    They just need to go to preference points with all appslications. I send in an app for me and my wife.last two yrs she got the permit and no draw for me. This year we both got permits. But I only purchased one, and one remained for second phase. What's the old saying "don't hate the players, hate the game"
  • etommy28etommy28 Posts: 311 Deckhand
    please explain how you have 16 or do you mean you have 7 friends who you will be hunting with?
  • etommy28etommy28 Posts: 311 Deckhand
    I got luck and squeezed in and go Okeechobee N week 1 i wanted west but will take north.
  • badbullgatorbadbullgator Posts: 1,571 Captain
    Finally got on about 1015, picked my permit submitted payment....................waited........waited......waited......error page!
    Started over, same thing submitted payment.....................................waited.......waited......comes back as unavaliabe! Tried two more times with the same results.
    WTH? Why make you sumit payment if it is not avaliable? End result is I got hosed. Two guys I hunt with got permits in phase one so we have four to kill, but the system is screwed from start to finish.
    "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government"

    -- Thomas Jefferson, 1 Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334
  • badbullgatorbadbullgator Posts: 1,571 Captain
    kmf600 wrote: »
    They need to require a deposite or even pay for the whole amount when you apply for the tag. If you don't win, you get your money back. This is crap, when 75 tags are awarded in Lake O and only half the people pay for them. If you win and don't pay, you shouldn't be allowed to apply next year, something, I don't know.

    I have said this for years now. They have created a mess with the current system. I am sure the majority here have their wives, gf's, dogs, grandmothers apply. Like the post above says I don't hate the players, I hate the game. I promise if people knew they would lose $75 if they didn't pick up tags, most people would only submit applications they knew they would pick up. I would to be opposed to a gator stamp for say $25-50 being required to apply.
    I also think preference points should apply to those not successful in the draw. I know people that seem to draw permits for every person who applies year after year. If it is a random draw it doesn't seem that the same people would be loads with permits year after year.
    "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government"

    -- Thomas Jefferson, 1 Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334
  • Captjohn5150Captjohn5150 Posts: 1,698 Captain
    I was awarded 8484 Orlando 9-5-2013 start date....put in my CC/BOA /debt number for payment, checked both boxes....white little box with spinning circle states processing......after 10 minutes of processing i get kicked off and out, my premit is gone...im on phone calling and talking to people......they better get me my permit back...it's their system thats screwed up....this is bull stuff......system sucks....
    For the love of all outdoors recreational activities....what my spelling is off, that will learn ya. Pimping ain't easy unless u went to FSU, its a BS course.
    What do u get when you can connect the dots, color inside the lines, and get your release papers.....sentence served, times up at Felon sentenced university.
    Floridas first woman's college.
    The only difference between FSU and all the other colleges are other colleges accept you into the university's. At FSU you are taken into custody.
  • mikefm58mikefm58 Posts: 265 Deckhand
    NY state had a similar problem with doe tags. Years ago they were free if you got selected, so everyone (including myself) would always apply, and most times got a doe tag. But I really didn't need it as I don't care to shoot doe and even if I did, my brother gets a ton of doe tags because of all the land he owns. Tags are transferrable in NY. This kept some hunters who hunt for the venison meat from getting a doe tag.

    So NY implements a non-refundable $10 application fee for a doe tag. Low and behold the number of doe tag applications drops significantly, and I no longer apply. I know it's only $10 but why bother. Now those who really want to shoot a doe for the meat stand a pretty good chance of getting a tag.
  • Captjohn5150Captjohn5150 Posts: 1,698 Captain
    Fl needs to have a 100 dollar deposit on all applicants who wish to apply for gator tags...refundable if you don't win, used towards permit if you win....this would stop alot of headaches..also cut down on multiple family members....this is nuts....2 or more people from same family get tags, yet other families not getting any...that's fair, that's real sportsmanship.....one set of tags per house hold period, phase 1 and 2..then free for all at left overs....
    This crap is nuts...I just hope the guys get me my tags as i was awarded them but system locked up and did not take my payment, yet it was tring to process it....
    For the love of all outdoors recreational activities....what my spelling is off, that will learn ya. Pimping ain't easy unless u went to FSU, its a BS course.
    What do u get when you can connect the dots, color inside the lines, and get your release papers.....sentence served, times up at Felon sentenced university.
    Floridas first woman's college.
    The only difference between FSU and all the other colleges are other colleges accept you into the university's. At FSU you are taken into custody.
  • ProFISHentProFISHent Posts: 731 Officer
    capt john I hate to hear that happened to you but I assure you, if the payment didnt go through....you aint gettin them.

    Same exact thing happened to me last year, I called them to simply ask what was going on and did I recieve them or not and they said no. I was frustrated because their system caused me to loose my tags, I spoke to a supervisor and he said he is very sorry there is nothing they could do at that point. I dont blame them, they arent going to add tags to the lake, and they sure arent going to take it from someone else to give to you. It stinks but its the system they have, its been bad for years but the past 3-4 have been by far the worst ive seen because of the new interest in this. I have a lot of friends who are super eager to gator hunt so I have everyone apply every year and those who win their tags, always pay for them and we always tag out on quality lizards. Personally it is a very frustrating system, I have been "randomly drawn" in first phase for 3 years now but I have buddies that win them pretty much every year. Its something I know going into it that I could walk away without my own tags. But I have a lot of gators to kill every year, as none of the people I take have boats.


    I personally disagree with the "1 set of tags per household". If me and my wife both want tags, or when me and my brother lived together and we would both apply I think it would be completely unfair for me to not be able to get a set because he got one. We hunt different areas, and a lot of times with different people.

    What I have told everything since the day swamp people started is that FLORIDA ALLIGATOR PERMITS SHOULD BE FL RESIDENTS ONLY. It is a VERY unique hunting oppurtunity, and they should make it that if you want to hunt gators in FL you must either be a resident OR hunt with one. This will do a few things. #1 local guides will have business. #2 there will be fewer folks on the water that "dont know what they're doing" #3 there will be more permits available for locals.

    alaska dosnt allow sport king crab traps unless you are with an alaskan resident, california (if i remember right) wont allow out of staters to hunt elk, I believe even Tennessee is that way with a few of their animals. With the popularity of this sport what is is now, the tags will sell out all the same. the state wont comply with this because its all $$$ and FL is a greedy greedy state.

    I lucked out this year and got my own tags, and 7 friends and acquaintances got tags, all of which will hunt with me until their tags are filled. last year we got 8 tags and killed 8 gators with an average of just over 10 ft.

    With any luck, those of you who didnt get tags this year, can find someone to hunt with or to split tags with.
  • Captjohn5150Captjohn5150 Posts: 1,698 Captain
    Im part of a Native American family that subsistence hunts......and we did not get tags because of a computer system malfunction on their payment end.....BS....
    It should be one set per house hold on phase one, phase 2 is for house holds wanting tags not given in round one...phase 3 should be bonus tags aka free for all buying....
    For the love of all outdoors recreational activities....what my spelling is off, that will learn ya. Pimping ain't easy unless u went to FSU, its a BS course.
    What do u get when you can connect the dots, color inside the lines, and get your release papers.....sentence served, times up at Felon sentenced university.
    Floridas first woman's college.
    The only difference between FSU and all the other colleges are other colleges accept you into the university's. At FSU you are taken into custody.
  • badbullgatorbadbullgator Posts: 1,571 Captain
    Im part of a Native American family that subsistence hunts......and we did not get tags because of a computer system malfunction on their payment end.....BS....
    It should be one set per house hold on phase one, phase 2 is for house holds wanting tags not given in round one...phase 3 should be bonus tags aka free for all buying....

    I think household option would be a problem because.
    1. Easy to get around and would not significantly reduce multiple applications. It would also not stop those who use people who do not actually hunt from making multiple applications (adult child that lives on their own, friends and family that are used to apply and live at different addresses).
    2. You make the assumption that a household is a traditional family unit. What about those who live with roommates or others who want to hunt for themselves and not the "household"? A lot would depend on the household. I have no problem with a husband and wife each getting a permit, or a father and son, or two brothers as long as both are actual hunters and are really seeking a permit of their own.

    I think the BIGGEST problem is that the state only issues 5-6000 permits 10-12000 tags). This in a state with an aligator population estimated to be close to 1.5 MILLION alligators. That means, assuming the highest number of tags 12,000, the state allows .8% of the alligators in the state to be harvested. Point eight percent. I am a scientist, but not a wildlife management biologist, and I have to say harvesting .8% of a species is far less than you would expect would be considered a sustainable harvest.
    "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government"

    -- Thomas Jefferson, 1 Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334
  • Derek ArsuaDerek Arsua Posts: 2,474 Officer
    You can go down to your county tax collector and purchase them there if you have an issue with the online method
  • etommy28etommy28 Posts: 311 Deckhand
    You can go down to your county tax collector and purchase them there if you have an issue with the online method

    I dont think that works with gator tags
  • kmf600kmf600 Posts: 188 Officer
    pbsnooker wrote: »
    They just need to go to preference points with all appslications. I send in an app for me and my wife.last two yrs she got the permit and no draw for me. This year we both got permits. But I only purchased one, and one remained for second phase. What's the old saying "don't hate the players, hate the game"

    I don't really hate the "player" but **** are another thing. I think you should be required to pay for both, end of story, or you don't get them the next year. But we will stick with the same system where 5 guys and their wives, kids, bff's and booty buddy applies for 30 tags, and pays for one. F-it, just sucks to not go this year, and probablly not for a couple of years to come too.
  • Captjohn5150Captjohn5150 Posts: 1,698 Captain
    Should be 100 dollar per entry...phase 1 you win you have 1 week to buy you tags, default and you loose your money....wait a week phase 2 100 entry , you have 72 hours to pay for tags....wait a week phase 3 100 entry open until gone 3 days to pay.....this will speed the process as well as cut back on multiple family members from entering every one...
    Oh ya no more stupid **** computer screw ups....like what happened to me....BS.....
    For the love of all outdoors recreational activities....what my spelling is off, that will learn ya. Pimping ain't easy unless u went to FSU, its a BS course.
    What do u get when you can connect the dots, color inside the lines, and get your release papers.....sentence served, times up at Felon sentenced university.
    Floridas first woman's college.
    The only difference between FSU and all the other colleges are other colleges accept you into the university's. At FSU you are taken into custody.
  • mccrackermccracker Posts: 354 Deckhand
    FWC should sell Gator tag scratch offs at local gas stations, $100 bucks a ticket
  • Captjohn5150Captjohn5150 Posts: 1,698 Captain
    That is too funny...I like it...
    The sad truth is.....if the florida lottery actually did handle the gator lottery it would run smooth as silk......the system they have now is a over loaded joke.....
    For the love of all outdoors recreational activities....what my spelling is off, that will learn ya. Pimping ain't easy unless u went to FSU, its a BS course.
    What do u get when you can connect the dots, color inside the lines, and get your release papers.....sentence served, times up at Felon sentenced university.
    Floridas first woman's college.
    The only difference between FSU and all the other colleges are other colleges accept you into the university's. At FSU you are taken into custody.
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