why illegal immigration will not be stopped...

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  • frankfrank Posts: 12,456 AG
    No matter even if all those 25 million workers show up at the fields, the businesses don't want people they'd have to compensate if they get sick, or pay overtime, or be in any way beholden to
    they want the illegal workers that won't expect the working conditions to be safe or be compensated fairly
    No political signature
  • fins4mefins4me Posts: 13,964 AG
    frank said:
    No matter even if all those 25 million workers show up at the fields, the businesses don't want people they'd have to compensate if they get sick, or pay overtime, or be in any way beholden to
    they want the illegal workers that won't expect the working conditions to be safe or be compensated fairly


    If those businesses require those conditions in order to prosper then they deserve to fail.
    ALLISON XB 21,, MERCURY 300 Opti Max Pro Series (Slightly Modified) You can't catch me!!!
    "Today is MINE"
  • frankfrank Posts: 12,456 AG
    but they don't
    they thrive, in part because of the the government officials like those above that get their back
    No political signature
  • mustang190mustang190 Posts: 9,022 Admiral
    Can you name those businesses??
    2013 Pathfinder 22 TE , 150 Yamaha,
  • mustang190mustang190 Posts: 9,022 Admiral
    Tell us, Dave, when was the last time a terrorist crossed the Mexican border illegally?

    Some of y'all need to live in reality.
    And your positive none never have?
    2013 Pathfinder 22 TE , 150 Yamaha,
  • frankfrank Posts: 12,456 AG
    no, but you know they're there, the hundresh of thousands of illegals are working somewhere
    No political signature
  • FloydFloyd ; in N. Tampa or DownEast MainePosts: 1,075 Officer
    cadman said:
    Let's discuss real solutions, 
    cadman said:

    Currently the unemployed only number about 6 million. Only about 9% of those on welfare are below 65, not disabled, and unemployed.  Do you think that those over 65 who are on medicaid and SSSI should be out picking fruit instead of starving? How about a guy in a wheel chair or blind? 

    Are you in favor of starving our elderly and disabled? They are 73% of those collecting some form of welfare. another 18% are those in low paying jobs. 

    You fall in the trap of believing the rhetoric without knowing the facts. 



    Speaking of facts, I call BS on your figures for Seniors receiving welfare. This source says 13%....not the 73% you suggest.

    https://www.creditdonkey.com/welfare-statistics.html

    Recording from Moderators annual meeting: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DuABc9ZNtrA
  • FloydFloyd ; in N. Tampa or DownEast MainePosts: 1,075 Officer
    BTW,  I don't think that medicare and Social Security are considered welfare.
    Recording from Moderators annual meeting: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DuABc9ZNtrA
  • AaronCannonAaronCannon Northwest ArkansasPosts: 180 Deckhand
    Tell us, Dave, when was the last time a terrorist crossed the Mexican border illegally?

    Some of y'all need to live in reality.
    Well if youre not in the Gang, gangs look pretty close to terrorist organizations.  Maybe more insidious when you factor in the effect drug sales have on populations.  Just a constant downward drag.
    Sure they need customers, and thats on the users, but plenty of Mexican ditchweed gets smoked by mexicans.
      Theyve branched out to supply the meth that the hillbilly cooks cant make anymore, and counterfeit pharmaceuticals as well.
     Anybody want to speculate where Prince's caretaker got ahold of his fatal dose? All i heard sofar was it was an exact counterfeit, made with fentanyl.

    The rifle itself has no moral stature, since it has no will of its own. Naturally, it may be used by evil men for evil purposes, but there are more good men than evil, and while the latter cannot be persuaded to the path of righteousness by propaganda, they can certainly be corrected by good men with rifles.
    Jeff Cooper
  • Fish HaidFish Haid Posts: 7,863 Admiral
    Well, if the government won't do anything, I think it's time we take care of the problem ourselves.  Who's with me?  Let's roll!
    23895.gif
  • SloughSlough S.w. Ga./ St. JamesPosts: 4,080 Captain
    fins4me said:
    I bet you the majority of the individuals on this site knows of someone who is considered disabled but should not be so classified. 

    I know of more than one. 
    Very true and then I know some that really are and can't get any help.
    I didn't say it was your fault, I said I was blaming you
  • FinfinderFinfinder Posts: 9,397 Admiral
    Floyd said:
    BTW,  I don't think that medicare and Social Security are considered welfare.
    medicaid 
  • cadmancadman Home of the Gators Posts: 23,535 AG
    Floyd said:
    cadman said:
    Let's discuss real solutions, 
    cadman said:

    Currently the unemployed only number about 6 million. Only about 9% of those on welfare are below 65, not disabled, and unemployed.  Do you think that those over 65 who are on medicaid and SSSI should be out picking fruit instead of starving? How about a guy in a wheel chair or blind? 

    Are you in favor of starving our elderly and disabled? They are 73% of those collecting some form of welfare. another 18% are those in low paying jobs. 

    You fall in the trap of believing the rhetoric without knowing the facts. 



    Speaking of facts, I call BS on your figures for Seniors receiving welfare. This source says 13%....not the 73% you suggest.

    https://www.creditdonkey.com/welfare-statistics.html

    Statistics is not your strong suit. 

    You are comparing two different numbers. Your data is 13% of seniors receive welfare, That 13% makes up 53% of the welfare recipients. One is the percent of population, the other is percent of those getting benefits. 

    https://www.cbpp.org/research/contrary-to-entitlement-society-rhetoric-over-nine-tenths-of-entitlement-benefits-go-to?fa=view&id=3677


    Mini Mart Magnate

  • cadmancadman Home of the Gators Posts: 23,535 AG
    Finfinder said:
    Floyd said:
    BTW,  I don't think that medicare and Social Security are considered welfare.
    medicaid 

    Finfinder said:
    Floyd said:
    BTW,  I don't think that medicare and Social Security are considered welfare.
    That's the one everyone forgets about. A lot of seniors in long term care and other medical issues rely on medicaid because it covers conditions medicare will not cover. Medicaid is the largest social program we have, bigger than medicare. 

    Mini Mart Magnate

  • swampwalkerswampwalker Posts: 1,140 Officer
    Is it possible that if the price and benefits of the field work went up, the local folks might do the work? Of course the price of the fruit and veggies and other trades would have to increase. Or the particular crop may no longer be profitable. We're kinda spoiled at having cheap crops that we actually pay more for with extra costs paid for the hospital, law enforcement, and education of folks that aren't here legally. These folks are working for cheap and most likely being mistreated and taken advantage of as illegals. A real quagmire we have.
    The original - "Renaissance Redneck"
  • Turner River TerrorTurner River Terror Posts: 4,973 Captain
    Is it possible that if the price and benefits of the field work went up, the local folks might do the work? Of course the price of the fruit and veggies and other trades would have to increase. Or the particular crop may no longer be profitable. We're kinda spoiled at having cheap crops that we actually pay more for with extra costs paid for the hospital, law enforcement, and education of folks that aren't here legally. This...but not this>>               These folks are working for cheap and most likely being mistreated and taken advantage of as illegals. A real quagmire we have
    I live in a 6000 Acre Farm..Folks from all over S. America here.
    Maybe 50 to 100 Full timers mostly Mexicans..Good Folks that make sure their Kids get good grades and parent well.
    Planting and Picking time it's 100's of Temp. Traveler folks from everywhere.
    Group Housing...one Rule , No fights or the Law.
    They have no real Roots yet cause their kinda new at the Game...recent arrivals , Seasonal.
    They all work hard and if you get a bad reputation you'll never get hired again.
    If we get rid of them it'll be..Would you like Tomato's and Lettuce with that , Only $5.99 extra.
    Crop Workers are not your Enemy ..These folks are here to work and make Cash .
    City Gangs full of these folks are...
    Killin and Grillin :grin
  • ResinheadResinhead Posts: 8,858 Admiral
    Cali seems to morphing. Should be interesting to see if anything comes of it.
  • frankfrank Posts: 12,456 AG
    Is it possible that if the price and benefits of the field work went up, the local folks might do the work? Of course the price of the fruit and veggies and other trades would have to increase. Or the particular crop may no longer be profitable. We're kinda spoiled at having cheap crops that we actually pay more for with extra costs paid for the hospital, law enforcement, and education of folks that aren't here legally. This...but not this>>               These folks are working for cheap and most likely being mistreated and taken advantage of as illegals. A real quagmire we have

    If w get rid of them it'll be..Would you like Tomato's and Lettuce with that , Only $5.99 extra.
    Crop Workers are not your Enemy ..These folks are here to work and make Cash ....
    And again, that is why the tide won't ever be fully stopped
    TRT, what do you think of e-verify?
    No political signature
  • fins4mefins4me Posts: 13,964 AG
    edited April 21 #50
    Throughout the southeast our jails are populated by non citizens . Local sheriff's here in eastern Tennessee report that oft times more than half of the jailed population is compromised by non citizens at huge taxpayer expense.

    They are thieves, commit a huge portion of drunk driving wrecks and hit and runs, they trespass, poach ponds, rivers and lakes. 

    Their children take resources from the school systems that should be utilized by children of US citizens instead of being wasted on them at huge taxpayer expense.

    They are washing out cultural norms throughout the nation.

    Being blind due to PC by so many will be the downfall of this nation. 
    ALLISON XB 21,, MERCURY 300 Opti Max Pro Series (Slightly Modified) You can't catch me!!!
    "Today is MINE"
  • mustang190mustang190 Posts: 9,022 Admiral
    Tell us, Dave, when was the last time a terrorist crossed the Mexican border illegally?

    Some of y'all need to live in reality.
    And your positive none never have?
    2013 Pathfinder 22 TE , 150 Yamaha,
  • Mister-JrMister-Jr Posts: 26,277 AG
    fins4me said:
    Throughout the southeast our jails are populated by non citizens . Local sheriff's here in eastern Tennessee report that oft times more than half of the jailed population is compromised by non citizens at huge taxpayer expense.

    They are thieves, commit a huge portion of drunk driving wrecks and hit and runs, they trespass, poach ponds, rivers and lakes. 

    Their children take resources from the school systems that should be utilized by children of US citizens instead of being wasted on them at huge taxpayer expense.

    They are washing out cultural norms throughout the nation.

    Being blind due to PC by so many will be the downfall of this nation. 
    I'm sure you have traced your heritage and ancestors back to those that originally arrived in America.  Who was the first of your clan to come to America and when did they arrive?   
    Vote for the other candidate
  • fins4mefins4me Posts: 13,964 AG
    Mister-Jr said:
    fins4me said:
    Throughout the southeast our jails are populated by non citizens . Local sheriff's here in eastern Tennessee report that oft times more than half of the jailed population is compromised by non citizens at huge taxpayer expense.

    They are thieves, commit a huge portion of drunk driving wrecks and hit and runs, they trespass, poach ponds, rivers and lakes. 

    Their children take resources from the school systems that should be utilized by children of US citizens instead of being wasted on them at huge taxpayer expense.

    They are washing out cultural norms throughout the nation.

    Being blind due to PC by so many will be the downfall of this nation. 
    I'm sure you have traced your heritage and ancestors back to those that originally arrived in America.  Who was the first of your clan to come to America and when did they arrive?   
    I do,,, been here longer than most and it has nothing to do with the discussion.
    ALLISON XB 21,, MERCURY 300 Opti Max Pro Series (Slightly Modified) You can't catch me!!!
    "Today is MINE"
  • Turner River TerrorTurner River Terror Posts: 4,973 Captain




    And again, that is why the tide won't ever be fully stopped
    TRT, what do you think of e-verify?
    I think it's a Great Idea..Hard to enforce right away but you have to start somewhere.
    Fins For Me had a good point as well..Are we already paying an extra $5.99 for that lettuce and maters ?
    Hospitals / Schools / Housing ect are not free either and us Taxpayers are supporting Farmer cheap Labor in many ways.
    We need  a system like the Sugar Growers used back in the day.
    Temp worker Permits...when the Crops were done you got sent home. If you didn't go and we caught you...you could never get another Permit.
    The Workers I see every day want to work $$. It's the Deadbeats we have to address.,,,now..
    Killin and Grillin :grin
  • dave44dave44 Posts: 6,715 Admiral
    Mister-Jr said:
    fins4me said:
    Throughout the southeast our jails are populated by non citizens . Local sheriff's here in eastern Tennessee report that oft times more than half of the jailed population is compromised by non citizens at huge taxpayer expense.

    They are thieves, commit a huge portion of drunk driving wrecks and hit and runs, they trespass, poach ponds, rivers and lakes. 

    Their children take resources from the school systems that should be utilized by children of US citizens instead of being wasted on them at huge taxpayer expense.

    They are washing out cultural norms throughout the nation.

    Being blind due to PC by so many will be the downfall of this nation. 
    I'm sure you have traced your heritage and ancestors back to those that originally arrived in America.  Who was the first of your clan to come to America and when did they arrive?   
    Thread derail with poorly thought out moral equivalency question. There are so many ways to show how irrelevant this question is it’s hard to fathom where the synapses failed.
  • TarponatorTarponator Under a BridgePosts: 9,611 Admiral
    edited April 22 #56
    Yeah, almost as irrelevant as the hearsay about the number of illegal immigrants in jail in eastern Tennessee, their participating in a "huge portion" of crimes, and the washing out of cultural norms in a thread about why illegal immigration won't stop. 

    And it's hardly an incorrect moral equivalence to suggest that Fin's ancestors were immigrants that came to this country for the very same reasons as the people he so despises.
  • dave44dave44 Posts: 6,715 Admiral
    Yeah, almost as irrelevant as the hearsay about the number of illegal immigrants in jail in eastern Tennessee, their participating in a "huge portion" of crimes, and the washing out of cultural norms in a thread about why illegal immigration won't stop. 

    And it's hardly an incorrect moral equivalence to suggest that Fin's ancestors were immigrants that came to this country for the very same reasons as the people he so despises.
    Historical context isn’t your friend, is it.
  • smooth movesmooth move Posts: 384 Deckhand
    Scoutboat said:
    After all this hoopla, the simple fact remains that we need people to pick the oranges, and do the roofing.
    Jobs that Anglos feel beneath them. 
    those are jobs that Americans won't do for 1/2 price and no benefits. not because they're beneath them.

    le se' bon ton roulet
  • TarponatorTarponator Under a BridgePosts: 9,611 Admiral
    edited April 22 #59
    dave44 said:
    Yeah, almost as irrelevant as the hearsay about the number of illegal immigrants in jail in eastern Tennessee, their participating in a "huge portion" of crimes, and the washing out of cultural norms in a thread about why illegal immigration won't stop. 

    And it's hardly an incorrect moral equivalence to suggest that Fin's ancestors were immigrants that came to this country for the very same reasons as the people he so despises.
    Historical context isn’t your friend, is it.
    It is, actually, which was the reason I pointed it out.   I'm not a big fan of hypocrisy, however.

    But perhaps you might explain what specific historical context you have in mind so we can discuss it further and perhaps have a productive discussion.

    For bonus points, you'll even relate it to the topic at hand -- you know, why illegal immigration is not likely to be stopped.   HINT: Historical context might help....if you choose the right one.  :)
  • dave44dave44 Posts: 6,715 Admiral
    dave44 said:
    Yeah, almost as irrelevant as the hearsay about the number of illegal immigrants in jail in eastern Tennessee, their participating in a "huge portion" of crimes, and the washing out of cultural norms in a thread about why illegal immigration won't stop. 

    And it's hardly an incorrect moral equivalence to suggest that Fin's ancestors were immigrants that came to this country for the very same reasons as the people he so despises.
    Historical context isn’t your friend, is it.
    It is, actually, which was the reason I pointed it out.   I'm not a big fan of hypocrisy, however.

    But perhaps you might explain what specific historical context you have in mind so we can discuss it further and perhaps have a productive discussion.

    For bonus points, you'll even relate it to the topic at hand -- you know, why illegal immigration is not likely to be stopped.   HINT: Historical context might help....if you choose the right one.  :)
    It’s not as mysterious as your feeble mentality makes it seem to you. 
          But, overall, nations have borders. Sneak into Mexico and take up residence. I would love for you to report back about your hosts hospitality, when they let you out of jail and kick you out of the country.
  • ResinheadResinhead Posts: 8,858 Admiral
    edited April 22 #61
    Dave....  be careful, you're flirting with the ignore feature.

    He usually takes advantage of that feature when his **** handed to him.

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