Shark Dragging vs Bait Fishing

First off, I'm not trying to criticize anybody's choice or method of fishing. Just curious what other people think.

I noticed an article on the main page about the individuals who drug the shark behind their boat being charged with a fealony. How is that different than pinning live bait to the bottom until it dies? It seems like there could be separate legal and moral discussions to the question.

I'm certainly not proud to dump dead bait back after it dies in the livewell. I've also wondered how much bait I'm willing to kill for fish I'm catching as sport.

Other times, I just figure that I'm taking a more active roll in the food chain and the dead bait is just crab food.

Is there a size cutoff where we can no longer kill and dismember an unregulated species for our enjoyment? If they had cut up the shark and used it as cut bait, would that still be a crime?
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Replies

  • drgibbydrgibby Posts: 1,209 Officer
    This ought to be good..................
  • toomertoomer Posts: 316 Deckhand
    drgibby wrote: »
    This ought to be good..................

    ...if anybody is reading this anymore.
  • lemaymiamilemaymiami Posts: 2,860 Captain
    --don't feed the troll
    Tight Lines
    Bob LeMay
    (954) 435-5666
  • ScarecrowScarecrow Posts: 338 Deckhand
    Just don't drag your bait behind your boat at high speeds before you bottom fish and you will be good to go.
  • Westwall01Westwall01 Posts: 4,681 Captain
    Chef Ramen wrote: »
    First off, I'm not trying to criticize anybody's choice or method of fishing. Just curious what other people think.

    I noticed an article on the main page about the individuals who drug the shark behind their boat being charged with a fealony. How is that different than pinning live bait to the bottom until it dies? It seems like there could be separate legal and moral discussions to the question.

    I'm certainly not proud to dump dead bait back after it dies in the livewell. I've also wondered how much bait I'm willing to kill for fish I'm catching as sport.

    Other times, I just figure that I'm taking a more active roll in the food chain and the dead bait is just crab food.

    Is there a size cutoff where we can no longer kill and dismember an unregulated species for our enjoyment? If they had cut up the shark and used it as cut bait, would that still be a crime?

    We here at Florida Sportsman forums wish to thank you for your impressive 12 contributions over the last 34 months, but we also understand if you never post here again.. Happy New Year!
  • CountryBumpkinCountryBumpkin Fla. Piney WoodsPosts: 1,277 Officer
    Chef Ramen wrote: »
    First off, I'm not trying to criticize anybody's choice or method of fishing. Just curious what other people think.

    We think you are a :troll.............but since you are making this thread about philosophical questions.........I'll offer up one.

    Why do the "in your face"....... "shock value"......."look at me I don't care what you or anybody else think"..........types who do this sort of thing to antagonize and annoy others just for "attention".............always snivel like little snot nose brats when they finally get the "attention" they are seeking? Now they are famous.........wasn't that their desire?:blowkiss

    I say......I say son.......new & improved my tail feathers.

  • Chef RamenChef Ramen Posts: 16 Greenhorn
    Correct, I post very infrequently in this forum.

    I don't intend to criticize anybody. If you felt antagonized, I apologize.

    I fish bait about half of my trips. I simply thought it was odd that I found the shark video difficult to watch but have no problem chunking a live lady fish for bait.

    I am still curious what people think. If nothing else I can double my post count denying that I am a troll.
  • CountryBumpkinCountryBumpkin Fla. Piney WoodsPosts: 1,277 Officer
    I was not referring to you as being an antagonizer......but rather the shark draggers.

    Perhaps you are not aware of their long history of posting all kinds of stuff on the internet most people would never think of doing.

    What would be "odd" is if you went on a fishing trip for 8 hours and only filmed the 3 minutes you were chopping up the live lady fish for bait. And laughed and giggled about how they squirm or the gills still move with the head off etc. And then posted it online to see how many "views" you could get.

    You do see how that is "philosophically wrong" don't you?:shrug

    I say......I say son.......new & improved my tail feathers.

  • Chef RamenChef Ramen Posts: 16 Greenhorn
    I'm aware of the history but wasn't thinking about it in this context.

    That's a good point about finding joy in the act or seeking publicity from it. I've yet to publish a video of myself cutting bait...

    I have no issue using bait to catch a fish to eat. For me, using bait for fish I'm catching as sport is less appealing than it was a year ago.
  • ANUMBER1ANUMBER1 Posts: 8,455 Admiral
    as a professional ocean **** I cringed when I saw that video..

    Them idiots didn't break any laws but.. but what a bunch of tools that need a beatdown till they **** blood, seriously.
    I am glad to only be a bird hunter with bird dogs...being a shooter or dog handler or whatever other niche exists to separate appears to generate far too much about which to worry.
  • kellerclkellercl Posts: 1,395 Officer
    1) a simple understanding of basic biology would help answer your question. baitfish breed in higher numbers and grow to maturity far faster then a shark. I mean is squishing a spider the same thing as shooting a lion? Of course not.

    as a result of grossly different reproductive tendencies certain animals need higher levels of protection than others. nobody worries about killing baitfish because they aren't in limited supply. I can go out for an hour and catch lord knows how many thousands of baitfish. good luck catching thousands of sharks in an hour.

    2) intent/purpose. the point of dragging a shark (in said video) was for fun... I guess. Honestly I don't know what their goal was. dragging a piece of bait has the purpose of catching a larger fish, more than likely for table fare. The rationale for one is far more reasonable than the other.

    Really, it isn't that hard to see the difference between the two, it really isn't. One has a purpose and has a minimal impact to the ecosystem... at this point I am going to assume you realize which is which.
  • kellerclkellercl Posts: 1,395 Officer
    ANUMBER1 wrote: »
    Them idiots didn't break any laws but..

    Based on what I have read that isn't exactly true. Apparently during the investigation there was a longer video where the fellows essentially harpooned another shark... which constitutes an illegal take... which is included in the charges being brought against them. I am not sure why people tend to gloss over this particular aspect. It seems like the authorities know they have those morons dead to rights on the illegal take and threw a few others charges to see if they will stick. I don't believe that is an uncommon practice. If nothing else it could be great leverage for a guilty plead to some lesser charges, saving court time (aka tax payer money).
  • This situation is pretty easy to understand with the word...."intent".........

    Killing a baitfish during a live bait trip has a much different intent that laughing and video of a bunch of tools torturing an animal to look like they were cool guys or something.

    Its a much safer mind that does the first thing vs the sicko doing the other...
  • ANUMBER1ANUMBER1 Posts: 8,455 Admiral
    kellercl wrote: »
    Based on what I have read that isn't exactly true. Apparently during the investigation there was a longer video where the fellows essentially harpooned another shark... which constitutes an illegal take... which is included in the charges being brought against them. I am not sure why people tend to gloss over this particular aspect. It seems like the authorities know they have those morons dead to rights on the illegal take and threw a few others charges to see if they will stick. I don't believe that is an uncommon practice. If nothing else it could be great leverage for a guilty plead to some lesser charges, saving court time (aka tax payer money).
    didn't gloss over anything, the act of dragging THAT shark (unless a no take species) wasn't illegal.
    Stupid, immature, psychotic, cruel, etc...
    But not illegal.
    I am glad to only be a bird hunter with bird dogs...being a shooter or dog handler or whatever other niche exists to separate appears to generate far too much about which to worry.
  • kellerclkellercl Posts: 1,395 Officer
    ANUMBER1 wrote: »
    didn't gloss over anything, the act of dragging THAT shark (unless a no take species) wasn't illegal.
    Stupid, immature, psychotic, cruel, etc...
    But not illegal.

    Again, dragging the shark isn't the only charge.... your original claim was they didn't break "any" laws... That isn't true. They illegal speared a shark.
  • ANUMBER1ANUMBER1 Posts: 8,455 Admiral
    kellercl wrote: »
    Again, dragging the shark isn't the only charge.... your original claim was they didn't break "any" laws... That isn't true. They illegal speared a shark.
    Please try to comprehend, I was only referring to the dragging...
    If you can't get that you gonna have a hard life.
    I am glad to only be a bird hunter with bird dogs...being a shooter or dog handler or whatever other niche exists to separate appears to generate far too much about which to worry.
  • kellerclkellercl Posts: 1,395 Officer
    ANUMBER1 wrote: »
    Please try to comprehend, I was only referring to the dragging...
    If you can't get that you gonna have a hard life.

    I comprehend just fine, thanks. That isn't what you typed in your original post. It is fine if you want to migrate those goal posts. But don't blame my comprehension for reading your post exactly as it was written. Only one of us typed your post, here is a hint.. it wasn't me.
  • ANUMBER1ANUMBER1 Posts: 8,455 Admiral
    kellercl wrote: »
    I comprehend just fine, thanks. That isn't what you typed in your original post. It is fine if you want to migrate those goal posts. But don't blame my comprehension for reading your post exactly as it was written. Only one of us typed your post, here is a hint.. it wasn't me.
    post #15 SHOULD have cleared it up for you, but.. lol


    Ambiguous much?
    I am glad to only be a bird hunter with bird dogs...being a shooter or dog handler or whatever other niche exists to separate appears to generate far too much about which to worry.
  • pottydocpottydoc Posts: 2,053 Captain
    ANUMBER1 wrote: »
    post #15 SHOULD have cleared it up for you, but.. lol


    Ambiguous much?
    He's going to have a hard life Art. Actually, he's just trying to look like he's a big deal. Like most of the small number of folks left on here. He'd probably one of the first to pile on someone keeping a sailfish, while proudly posting a pic of himself with a 49 3/4" LJTF sword pup.
  • Soda PopinskiSoda Popinski GrovelandPosts: 8,181 Admiral
    I don't even drag artificials behind the boat anymore for fear they might accidentally snag a large pelagic by the mouth causing me to have to reel it in and see what it is.
    People use statistics the way a drunk uses a street light, for support rather than illumination.
  • kellerclkellercl Posts: 1,395 Officer
    pottydoc wrote: »
    He's going to have a hard life Art. Actually, he's just trying to look like he's a big deal. Like most of the small number of folks left on here. He'd probably one of the first to pile on someone keeping a sailfish, while proudly posting a pic of himself with a 49 3/4" LJTF sword pup.

    Lol, so many things about that post are inaccurate. Gotta love that ongoing June 2011 good ole boys club this place has going on. And people wonder why this place is borderline dead.
  • ANUMBER1ANUMBER1 Posts: 8,455 Admiral
    It's an exclusive club, maybe when you grow up you'll get an invite..
    I am glad to only be a bird hunter with bird dogs...being a shooter or dog handler or whatever other niche exists to separate appears to generate far too much about which to worry.
  • kellerclkellercl Posts: 1,395 Officer
    ANUMBER1 wrote: »
    It's an exclusive club, maybe when you grow up you'll get an invite..

    No thanks. I literally got zero interest in being part of said club. But thanks anyway. :)
  • ANUMBER1ANUMBER1 Posts: 8,455 Admiral
    kellercl wrote: »
    No thanks. I literally got zero interest in being part of said club. But thanks anyway. :)

    Mom said no?
    I am glad to only be a bird hunter with bird dogs...being a shooter or dog handler or whatever other niche exists to separate appears to generate far too much about which to worry.
  • kellerclkellercl Posts: 1,395 Officer
    ANUMBER1 wrote: »
    Mom said no?
    Your mom hasn't said no to me yet.
  • ANUMBER1ANUMBER1 Posts: 8,455 Admiral
    kellercl wrote: »
    Your mom hasn't said no to me yet.
    nice!
    I am glad to only be a bird hunter with bird dogs...being a shooter or dog handler or whatever other niche exists to separate appears to generate far too much about which to worry.
  • dragon baitdragon bait Posts: 5,593 Admiral
    ANUMBER1 wrote: »
    It's an exclusive club, maybe when you grow up you'll get an invite..

    It can't be that exclusive if they let the likes of me in
  • ScarecrowScarecrow Posts: 338 Deckhand
    I would never join a club that would have me as a member.
  • pottydocpottydoc Posts: 2,053 Captain
    kellercl wrote: »
    Lol, so many things about that post are inaccurate. Gotta love that ongoing June 2011 good ole boys club this place has going on. And people wonder why this place is borderline dead.
    Notbafter theynread your posts they don't. After just one of them, it's very obvious why it's border line dead.
  • kellerclkellercl Posts: 1,395 Officer
    pottydoc wrote: »
    Notbafter theynread your posts they don't. After just one of them, it's very obvious why it's border line dead.

    Is English not your first language?
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